Is there a "Soul"?
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I see this question was posed back in 2006(?) and the discussion didn't extend very far.
What is the position of Crowley/Thelema in regards to the "Soul". I'm realizing I should be specific considering the qabalist approach to the multi-level soul seems to be used in conceptualizing (Nephesh, Ruach, Neshamah, Chiah & Yechidah).
So maybe I'll be a bit more specific. What, in your experience/opinion, happens to these different levels of the soul when someone dies?
What happens to the average joe american who gives little thought to existence?
Say someone has attained K&C?
What of the one who has crossed the Abyss and let go of identity? -
For decades, I've lectured on this, taught this - could sit without preparation and talk a couple of hours on it - but there's no way I'm going to have time to write what would amount to a small book on the subject.
Of all this long list of things, is there, perhaps one (maybe two) particular, specific questions that are most important to you? Anything I can answer in 5-10 minutes...
PS - Crowley's position - as you suspected, definitions and specifics are important. I think Little Essays might be your best single source of explanation of his point of view on the layers and faculties of consciousness. After death? Dion Fortune had it almost perfectly right in the main part of Through the Gates of Death.
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Thanks for the reply Jim. I'll try to be brief but my curiosity is most weighted towards what happens to those who have attained "Hadit" at a minimum. I share my story for context of my question and look forward to hearing others experiences and thoughts.
Without getting into too much backstory I had multiple experiences beginning a decade ago that
confirmed reincarnation is true on some level.I'm having trouble understanding what "carried" that pattern into this incarnation, Hadit?
I attained K&C spontaneously and effortlessly years ago as well, it's part of this incarnations trajectory and probably had little to do with spiritual "talent".
Almost three years ago I had an incredible experience during a ritual where I imbibed a powerful psychedelic.
I came into contact with the Babalon archetype. She beckoned me to a crystalline sphere and I swore I gave all to reach her. After this scene I found the three creatures of Fortune whirling about me as I stood in a triangle. The situation was very intense. Horus boomed from behind me, "Become the God Atomic!" The three forces converged at the center of the triangle where I stood and I became the most magnificent, omnipotent power I could ever imagine. This cannonball of atomic energy shot through the universe and I tore through stars, galaxies, everything.When I came to from the ritual my mind was in tatters. My identity had imploded. I spent 9 months of mental anguish attempting to put myself together until the riddle of the sphinx came to me and I let myself "fall apart״. It was then when I saw who I "am"; diffused mind localized. Maybe that's a way of saying it. I was transformed regardless and entered a new phase of further clarity.
I've considered Buddha was talking about ego when he said "anatman" but now I wonder if he was referring to a higher state such as hadit level consciousness as he pushed cessation of the reification of a perceived self. Does Hadit fall under such a classification considering it's nature is supernal?
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Mercurius,
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law.
I have had the experience of what I felt to be my soul when I once fell madly in love with this woman (It was a kind of divine love beyond the normal human experience.).
I then became aware of this incredible & unbearable pain in my stomach. If you have seen the movie Alien, it actually felt like having this alien entity (having a will of it's own) in the stomach almost trying to get out! The samurai's said that the soul is seated in the stomach and due to my own experience I now share that understanding.
When I die my Lord Hadit will simply move on to new playgrounds (I know since existence is such a bliss!). And either I will be aware or I will be unconscious of this last going. Who cares really?
Love is the law, love under will.
Peace
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@Mercurius said
"It was then when I saw who I "am"; diffused mind localized."
I'd have put the quotes around "I" instead of "am." In any case, the last three words do help provide the answer."I'm having trouble understanding what "carried" that pattern into this incarnation, Hadit?"
In a sense. That, at least, is the "localization." The best I have been able to determine from observation etc., in death we withdraw only to the Briatic level. (Briah = the "star," the "house of Hadit" or Yod). It is in Briah that the sankharas a formulated, what are normally called "tendencies." (Persisting patterns and relationships in personality exist within the Yetziratic aspects of us and are personal. The same sort of persisting patterns and relationships outside of a particular personality / incarnation, persisting across multiple incarnations, are Briatic.) Hadit, of course, is at the "center" of his "house." Paradoxically, Hadit, who seems at first to be equivalent to the Theosophic idea of the "individuality" by being a single point, is also every point - that which is most distinctly "me" is both defined by its point-distinction and, at the same time, is the same point-self that exists at all points - Hadit is everywhere.
I let myself ramble there a bit to get some pieces on the chess board. Moving around those, with what you already know or think, may help answer, or at least clarify, a number of questions.
I'll also mention that thinking of our various incarnations as successive is a convenience of intellect. Time is only a distinguished factor below four dimensions. As early as 4D awareness, all points in time are "simultaneous" (to twist the English language usefully); therefore, all incarnations (all self-expressions that aren't distinguished by 5D or higher-D differences) coexist. It is the nature of intellect, though, to organize time by sequencing it. Physicists also tend, at the moment, to hold the view that the physical universe exists in different states of differentiation (different states of entropy), so that the relative entropy levels at different points along the dimension time will give an objective linear sequencing within those particular 3D bounds.
"I've considered Buddha was talking about ego when he said "anatman" but now I wonder if he was referring to a higher state such as hadit level consciousness as he pushed cessation of the reification of a perceived self. Does Hadit fall under such a classification considering it's nature is supernal?"
Hadit, unextended, has no perception of self. Perception of self requires at least 2: a point of observation and a point observed. Hadit is just going.
So: In a practical, meaningful way, what does all of this theory give you?
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Thank you for the informative reply Jim. I started reading Little Essays last night, again. It's been years and is time for review.
Yes, the "star". I was meditating recently and that line from the Rite of Jupiter came to me.
"Thrown off like planets from the Sun
Ye are but satellites of the One.
But should your revolution stop
Ye would inevitably drop
Headlong within the central Soul,
And all the parts become the Whole."I once had a vision of "myself" as a Star (Every Man and Woman Is a Star) throwing off identities in multiple timeframes. The multiple aspects of this star were basically exploring the game of existence in eternal play so I really appreciate the 5D expression. I've had a few spontaneous visions before where i realized that reincarnation may better be termed parallel incarnations but then it gets tricky with words.
It was after this first breakthrough/resolution to the trauma of my "God Atomic" trip that I saw point-self in all. Even my cat! Ha! The feeling of currently existing in a "Matrix" of sorts takes some adjusting. I guess i ask "now what" because there is such a huge gap in how i saw myself before and now, that I'm wondering how much of this awareness carries over, into the continuity of consciousness. I suppose what's hard is we are trying to quantify extremely heavy experiences into a succinct phrase; like trying to visualize a hypercube in 2D
http://static2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20091021131904/uncyclopedia/images/7/72/Hypercube.gif
"Hadit, unextended, has no perception of self. Perception of self requires at least 2: a point of observation and a point observed. Hadit is just going.
So: In a practical, meaningful way, what does all of this theory give you?"Right, good reminder. Hadit reminds us of this repeatedly. I suppose the primary reason I asked was some verbal clarification because i tend to "think" in images and feeling. The discussion really adds alot of impetus to what i know deep down. I'm both curious and fascinated by the idea of dying and what occurs after especially if one knows they are most themselves at the axle of the wheel. It gives me a confirmation that I'm asking myself this question for a reason and need to let it all sink in and do some more reading also.
Another reason i ask is for some reason i have a lot of people ask me my thoughts on spiritual matters and someone recently asked me, "do you believe in the soul". And I thought Yes/No/Whatdoyoumeanbysoul? ha! I think the concept of a static soul becomes conflated with ego for many and can serve as a burden to accessing deeper insight. Prob why Buddha railed against it.
My Grandma is a hardcore xian and thinks it's sad i don't believe in a christian heaven where we all retain our identity. "Won't you miss your wife and children?" I find them no less precious just because they won't be preserved in their current state for eternity, in fact it makes them more precious to me, the opportunity i have in this life to experience aspects of consciousness uniquely expressed as my wife and children, brothers and parents. These moments are rare like gems. I said, "Grandma, this life is Heaven to me." She can't stand that. "What about all the wars and fighting!!" I usually bow out there. I don't want to get into the problem of "evil" with them. Having a greater understanding of self/soul can free people from the delusion of identity, thus suffering because one may then realize that which suffers is an illusion.The idea of the Soul is such a loaded concept so i feel its important for me to become better at understanding and expressing it's modes because the idea has been w man so long and needs to be challenged as a simple yes/no.
As an aside, after my most recent "upgrade" in consciousness I firmly believe Crowley is a prophet, something i was wishy-washy about before. The world just doesn't get that guy.