technical question on the New Aeon

the atlas itch

Crowley suggests in his writing that:

The Old Aeon = the sub-abyss realm
The New Aeon = the supra-abyss realm
If so, does that mean an adept has not entered the New Aeon until attaining 8=3?
Would it be correct to say the New Aeon manifests only insofar as the number of adepts who cross the abyss?

Jim Eshelman

Where did he suggest this? Quote please.

I've heard people assert it; but, unless it was a passing thought, I can't recall ever encountering it in his writings.

I'm not commenting, at the moment, on whether the statement is true in some sense. I'm saying: Where did he say it?

PS - Regardless of the truth of it: Every human body begins as a single cell and recapitulates the evolutionary history of the species (in broad strokes). Each person is born at a particular point in the survivability of the embryo. But the consequence of all of this is, regardless of where the adult threshold of enlightenment lands, each person born has to pass through all the stages of development (all of the Tree, so to speak) from the deep recesses of Malkuth on up. One doesn't suddenly start halfway up the Tree.

atlantis

Then what about the Aeon-tarot card placing?

Jim Eshelman

@atlantis said

"Then what about the Aeon-tarot card placing?"

What's the question exactly?

the atlas itch

Jim – I tried unsuccessfully in attempting to track down the quote. The line that stuck in my head is where he writes somewhere that the New Aeon is the light of the Supernals shining down into the lower realms of the Tree - something to that effect. I have nonetheless outlined below the background to my question, which turned out rather long. Please critique if you disagree.

Atlantis – you bring up a good point. If I understand you correctly, you're asking why did Crowley map the Aeon card on the path between Malkuth and Hod if the New Aeon is only attained by crossing the Abyss. First, let me give some context:

When Crowley wrote The Book of Thoth toward the end of his life, published 3 years before his death, he incorporated the doctrine of Liber Legis and the Vision and the Voice into his comments on the Atus. So the Thoth deck was meant to be the Tarot for the New Aeon:

*This new Tarot may therefore be regarded as a series of illustrations to The Book of the Law; the doctrine of that Book is everywhere explicit. * (BOT, p. 116)

Unfortunately many of his comments in BoT are quite obscure, if not confusing or contradictory. It’s tempting to conclude this ambiguity arose from the conflict between Crowley’s Old Aeon conditioning, incorporation of GD symbolism and Eliphas Levi and his understanding of the New Aeon, which took a lifetime to fully realize. I suspect when he wrote BoT he knew that death was approaching and simply left hints behind to let the reader figure out what his meaning. Whatever the case may be, his main focus was on the symbolism of the Thoth deck itself whereas the BoT was only intended to be a commentary. It’s also appears he was not too worried about what the reader thought of the BoT as evidenced by his funny Bibliographical Note:

The accompanying booklet was dashed off by Aleister Crowley, without help from parents. It’s perusal may be omitted with advantage. (BOT, xii)

Now when I study the mapping of the Atus on to the Tree, I cannot help but notice a doubling of symbolism on the Tree that seems to correspond to the Cairo Working and Bou Saada Working as follows.

NOX

Crowley maps the Aeon card on to the path between Malkuth and Hod and the Moon card on to the path between Malkuth and Netzach. If you study the details of the Stele carefully, plus his comments on these cards, it is the NOX formula, where the sun begins the descent into Night to be resurrected at Tiphareth. This ascent from Malkuth to Tiphareth signifies one cycle of Night and Day. But what is important to note is that *this is still Old Aeon symbolism *where the resurrection of Christ has been attained at Tiphareth/LVX/IAO. Moreover the idea that the sub-abyss realm of the Tree = the Old Aeon is implied by Crowley’s comments that the sephiroths from Malkuth to Tiphareth form the Cross, whereas the upper sephiroths of the Tree, where Tiphareth is the lowest point of the hexagram, form the Rose or Circle (BOT, 75, 114).

I believe the above represents Crowley’s initial understanding of Liber Legis, from the years 1904 to 1908. When he carried out the Bou Saada Working, however, he became initiated into the same symbolism on a deeper level and thus the NOX formula appears on a higher location on the Tree, in the transition from 7=4 to 8=3, where the adept becomes a Babe of the Abyss to be reborn in the womb of Babalon.

For example Crowley’s comments on the Tower card, depicting the Eye of Horus/Shiva opening to destroy the Tower, symbolizes the destruction of the Old Aeon on one level, but on another level is clearly a coded reference to his sex magick working with Neuberg, which hurled him across the Abyss (the Eye of Horus harks back to Horus pretending to offer his backside to Set in their contending and thereby gaining dominance over Set and avenging the memory of his father Osiris, much in the same way Crowley, while assuming the passive role, used Neuberg for his own purposes)

We know Tiphareth symbolizes the Sun and dawning light of the New Aeon, but if so, Crowley’s mapping of the NOX formula between 7=4 to 8=3 is decidedly curious. It suggests the Day transitions into Night for yet another death and subsequent rebirth.

The following is based on my own research, which refers to the opening question on whether the New Aeon is technically signified by being born from the womb of Babalon or by the dawning sun at Tiphareth pursuant to Old Aeon symbolism. The symbolism of the Sphinx and City of the Pyramids associated with the 8=3 grade implies yet another dawning or birth. I suspect Crowley’s description of the grade must have been influenced by what he saw in Egypt. The Great Sphinx of Giza lies facing East, protecting the Great Pyramids, the tomb of the pharaohs, and functions as a guardian and solar symbol representing dominion from “horizon to horizon”, from the setting to the rising of the sun, encircling the Earth (an idea that mutates and reappears in the sworded Sphinx sitting atop the Great Wheel in the Fortune Card). But rather than the mere rebirth of the sun, the adept's birth from the womb of Babalon opens to a night sky filled with stars, similar to the ka of the pharaohs ascending out of the Pyramids to the stars.

BALANCING OF THE FOUR

A comparison of Crowley’s description of Tiphareth/KCHGA and Binah/Babalon shows yet another doubling of symbolism. The Sun is attained by balancing the four elements. Similarly the Pyramid is built up by the four sides, a balancing of the four.
………………

The above indicates a doubling of the same symbolism, namely the cycle of the sun descending into night and reappearing as day, from Malkuth to Tiphareth, before descending into night again, from Tiphareth to Binah. One can reach two possible conclusions from this fact: 1) the doubling arises from confusion between Crowley’s Old Aeon conditioning and attempt to impart his understanding of the New Aeon into the Thoth deck; or 2) the ascent from Malkuth to Binah is not one cycle but two – hence Crowley’s comments on the spiral with regards to the Atu XVII The Star:

It will be seen that every form of energy in this picture is spiral. Zoroaster says, “God is he, having the head of a hawk; having a spiral force”. It is interesting to notice that this oracle appears to anticipate the present Aeon, that of the hawk-headed Lord, and also of the mathematical conception of the shape of the Universe as calculated by Einstein and his school. It is only in the lower cup that the forms of energy issuing forth show rectilinear characteristics. (BOT, p. 110)

The lower cup issuing forth “rectilinear characteristics” symbolizes the Cross, i.e. the lower realm of the Tree. Hence the Lady of the Stars pours the spiralling “milk of the stars” from the Supernals down to the lower realms of the Tree, “indicating the eternal renewal of the categories, the inexhaustible possibilities of existence” (BoT, p. 109).

Here the symbolism starts to accrue doubled significance: the adept’s emergence from the womb of Babalon to a night sky filled with stars, mirrors the ka of the pharaoh ascending from the pyramids to the stars, as well as the imagery of the poetic paraphrase on the reverse of the Stele. The Stele, in turn, connects back to Crowley’s comments on the Aeon Card, mapped all the way back down on the path between Malkuth and Hod, where he writes on the Last Judgment and the dead rising up from the graves. In a passage that now seems to be filled with double-entendres, Crowley writes:

The old card was called The Angel: or, The Last Judgment. It represented an Angel or Messenger blowing a trumpet, attached to which was a flag, bearing the symbol of the Aeon of Osiris. Below him the graves were opening, the dead rising up. There were three of them. The central one had his hands raised with right angles at the elbows and shoulders, so as to form the letter Shin, which refers to Fire. The card therefore represented the destruction of the world by Fire. This was accomplished in the year of the vulgar era 1904, when the fiery god Horus took the place of the airy god Osiris in the East as the Hierophant (see Atu V). At the beginning, then, of this new Aeon, it is fit to exhibit the message of that angel who brought the news of the new Aeon to earth. The new card is thus of necessity an adaptation of the Stele of Revealing.(BOT, p. 115).

Any feedback welcome.

Jim Eshelman

@he atlas itch said

"Crowley maps the Aeon card on to the path between Malkuth and Hod and the Moon card on to the path between Malkuth and Netzach."

Which simply means that he perpetuated the traditional system that he received in that regard.

"Moreover the idea that the sub-abyss realm of the Tree = the Old Aeon is implied by Crowley’s comments that the sephiroths from Malkuth to Tiphareth form the Cross"

This is wrong thinking. It is founded on a prejudice that the cross is not a symbol of the Aeon of Horus. Though a specific interpretation of that cross is no longer the most effective mechanism of initiation, the symbol itself remains valid and potent.

You seem also to have a prejudice that LVX is not of the current Aeon, that only NOX is is. That's both silly and wrong.

"I believe the above represents Crowley’s initial understanding of Liber Legis, from the years 1904 to 1908. When he carried out the Bou Saada Working, however, he became initiated into the same symbolism on a deeper level and thus the NOX formula appears on a higher location on the Tree, in the transition from 7=4 to 8=3, where the adept becomes a Babe of the Abyss to be reborn in the womb of Babalon."

This, of course, is highly relevant to the Adept who is becoming a Master. You correctly state that it is a process undergone by someone already an Adept.

"We know Tiphareth symbolizes the Sun and dawning light of the New Aeon, but if so, Crowley’s mapping of the NOX formula between 7=4 to 8=3 is decidedly curious. It suggests the Day transitions into Night for yet another death and subsequent rebirth."

The error here is that you're continuing to treat this movement up the Tree in terms of daily rotation of the Earth (Sun entering day, night, day, etc.). That's... curious, and, of course, an astronomical formula central to the Aeon of Horus. I think you need a different metaphor. My preferred metaphor is that the attainment of Tiphereth and LVX represents bright sunlight reverberating about us to give the clearest of daytime skies (above all interfering clouds), which only occurs in an atmosphere, i.e., in the element of Air. But in continuing our ascent we break from the Earth's atmosphere and enter open space. This is the symbol of NOX - the night of even greater height and luminosity from breaking free of an atmosphere into the open embrace of the body of Nuit among the infinitude of stars.

Or something like that. But notice that this has no terrestrial rotation in it, in fact no solar cycle at all.

"A comparison of Crowley’s description of Tiphareth/KCHGA and Binah/Babalon shows yet another doubling of symbolism. The Sun is attained by balancing the four elements. Similarly the Pyramid is built up by the four sides, a balancing of the four."

The pyramid is begun in the work of the Neophyte in Malkuth - by a specific assignment concerning the Four Powers of the Sphinx. It needs to be raised in a fashion that continues balance of the four sides, and is all-but-completed in Chesed. (Sometimes the completed pyramid is a symbol of Chesed, but in most cases the trunctaed pyramid, still missing its capstone, is the preferred symbol.) The descent of the capstone upon the otherwise complete pyramid is an equivalent symbol to the descent of Nuit upon the otherwise complete Adept.

"The above indicates a doubling of the same symbolism, namely the cycle of the sun descending into night and reappearing as day, from Malkuth to Tiphareth, before descending into night again, from Tiphareth to Binah."

Again, you're the one putting this in Old Aeon language. I can see why, perhaps, you see some conflict here, but I assure you that the conflict isn't in the symbols themselves but, rather, in what you are projecting onto them.

Frater SOL

@Jim Eshelman said

"Every human body begins as a single cell and recapitulates the evolutionary history of the species (in broad strokes)."

Do you think this inclues philosophical evolution? ...what I mean is, do you think that each human must also go through every philosophical revelation on an individual level that has brought humanity to its present understanding of man & existence?

729

the atlas itch

@Jim Eshelman said

"You seem also to have a prejudice that LVX is not of the current Aeon, that only NOX is is. That's both silly and wrong."

I am not aware of having preference toward either LVX or NOX. At best I'm trying to understand Crowley's usage of these formulae. However JD Gunther does claim that NOX is now the formula of the New Aeon:
………………..
*As we have observed, one of the chief characteristics of the Aeon of Osiris was a preference for the symbols of light. The formula of LVX through which the adepts addressed their understanding of the facts of nature and the means of overcoming them, although efficacious, represents an incomplete perception of the universe. Our representation of the Godhead as solar no longer requires the antagonism of light and night as a basic premise. The geocentric perspective alone considers the sun as “rising” or “setting” and the earth as the fixed point. The sun shines just as brightly on the far side of the planet at midnight. Sunset is only an “event” on the earth; from the point of view of the sun there would be no perception.

Our ancestors, fearing that the sun would not return, devised elaborate rituals to insure the sun’s return at dawn. Unlike our primitive forebears, we do not fear that the sun has been devoured by some chthonic creature of darkness. Again, from the perspective of the sun, there are only the distant points of light from other stars. The sun is perpetually in darkness…

In this Aeon, the central formula is not LVX, but NOX. Much more than the balance or opposite of LVX, the formula of NOX is that of the Mother (Heh), while LVX was once that of the Son (Vav). The former once opened the Vault of Abiegnus; the latter opens the Gates of the City of the Pyramids.

Note the past tense usage in the former case, for LVX will no longer open the Vault of the Mountain of Adepts; it now opens the Four Gates to the Palace at the foot of that Mountain. No longer is it the word of the Son Tiphereth, but of the Daughter Malkuth who borders upon the Shells. The formula INRI has no relationship to this LVX and is useful primarily to those who have not yet accepted the Law of Thelema [JDG footnote: Cf Book of Thoth, p. 276: “this doctrine is for the weaker brethren, for those who are suffering from the illusion of imperfection; it enables them to make their way to the illimitable Light”]. This is all very technical and of interest only to aspirants to the A.A.*

(Initiation in the Aeon of the Child, “A Universe of Darkness,” pp 34 – 36; emphasis mine)

*In the first chapter, I made a brief reference to a significant change that occurred with the advent of the Aeon of the Child, in what pertains to the formula of LVX. I stated that LVX will no longer open the Vault of Abiegnus, the Mountain of Adepts, as it did in the Aeon of Osiris, and will now explain why.

First, for those unfamiliar with the Vault of Abiegnus, this is the mystical name Initiates applied to the Tomb of the Adepts, which was said to be situated in the center of the earth, in the Mountain of the Caverns, which is the Mountain of God in the Center of the Universe…[lengthy explanation of GD 5=6 initiation based on the discovery of Rosencreutz’s sepulcher etc]….The “Light of the Cross” (LVX) which along with the key word INRI opened the tomb, was completely identified with Jesus Christ, and the Candidate who was symbolically crucified with Christ, arose with him. It was a marvelous example of the formula of the Dying God applied to Ritual. Despite its beauty, which is undeniable, it is an incomplete formula and no longer applicable to Tiphereth. In order to understand this more fully, we must first turn our attention to the changes the New Aeon brought to our comprehension of the Tree of Life, and the formulae that can lead to that comprehension.

With the coming of the Aeon of Horus, the Lord of the Aeon planted the seeds of change in the fertile earth of Malkuth, shook the stability of Yesod, and rearranged the Harmony of Tiphereth. The water of Life was sprinkled in the dry sands of the Abyss so that one day they will flower. The formulae that were considered Supreme were overshadowed by those of a new age. The Eye of Hoor was opened and the established kingdoms were shattered to pieces…

"…As stated earlier, LVX will now only open the Four Gates at the foot of the mountain of Abiegnus. Now, the “foot of the mountain” is Malkuth, who bears the title “Gate of the Daughter of the Mighty Ones”. The four quadrants of Malkuth are the Four Gates. These Gates must, in some fashion, be entered by all mankind eventually, in order to partake fully of the material life. A person of normal consciousness may indeed pass through them in the course of his life. In this case, it would be one at a time. Rarely are all conquered. The Initiate, on the other hand, granted the Keys to the Kingdom, may enter them simultaneously by virtue of the Great Name. This is a matter known to Neophytes of the A.A. who have experienced Ritual DCLXXI. Having confronted the challenges of the guardians of the Gates, and being gilded by the fullness of Light, they are granted admission. The price of admission in this manner is having gone thus far, there is no turning back. Yet, it is the LVX of Adonai that lights the path of the Candidate with every step, and the LVX of Adonai that opens the way…

All these things take place under the all-seeing Eye and by virtue of the Rose and Cross. While the emblem of the Rose and Cross is specifically referred to Tiphereth, it is by no means limited to Tiphereth, for the Rose is Nuit and the Cross is Had [JDG quotes here a passage from Vision and Voice, 23rd Aethyr]…

As I stated in the first chapter, the key word NOX is that which will open the Gates of the City of Pyramids in Binah. Now the primary reason that LVX will no longer open the Vault of Abiegnus, the mountain of the Adepts, is because the Vault must be opened by virtue of the word NOX. Why? Because Abiegnus, the Mountain of the Adepts in the New Aeon is identical with Zion, the Holy Mountain of God, the City of the Pyramids under the Night of Pan.*

(Initiation in the Aeon of the Child, “Transmutations”, pp. 148-155; emphasis mine)
…………………
Now I don’t feel qualified to assert whether Gunther is right or wrong, but he makes a consistently strong claim on the importance of NOX for the New Aeon (my own questioning came when I discovered the NOX formula in the poetic paraphrase of the Stele and I started examining the significance of the moon – or more precisely moonlight as reflection of the sun). He implies, rightly or wrongly, the lower realm of the Tree = the Old Aeon and the crossing of the Abyss and access to the Supernals is the nature of the New Aeon. I’ve already quoted the following passage on this forum before – and apologies for repetition – but will do so again as it links to my opening question:

The New Aeon completely changed the formulae of Supreme Initiation, for it has “fixed the Volatile” above the great desert which is the Abyss. Prior to this the dogma of the Sephiroth above the Abyss was an intellectual construction, albeit informed by Neshamah. There was no method of instruction for crossing this great gulf which separates the Ideal and the Actual. In fact, Osirian systems had no concept of “crossing” the Abyss at all. Evidence of this may be found in the symbolism of the planetary hexagram of nature.

(Initiation in the Aeon of the Child, p. 41-42; emphasis mine)

I like the metaphor you provide of entering the upper atmosphere before breaking into open space. The ascending metaphor is much less confusing than using the solar cycle – even though the night and day symbolism is used in the Tarot. I also agree with the observation that there is no solar cycle since the whole point is to identify with the sun instead of watching the sun rise and set.

Jim Eshelman

@Arsihsis said

"
@Jim Eshelman said
"Every human body begins as a single cell and recapitulates the evolutionary history of the species (in broad strokes)."

Do you think this inclues philosophical evolution? ...what I mean is, do you think that each human must also go through every philosophical revelation on an individual level that has brought humanity to its present understanding of man & existence?"

The body (especially its neurology) must mature to the point where it can sustain a particular consciousness. Whatever the evolution of consciousness in prior incarnations, whatever the greatness of the soul, it requires a sufficiently developed vehicle to contain and express it.

Let me give an approximate analogy. Pretty much everyone coming back into incarnation has prior experience with sex, sexual emotions, etc. Yet until puberty hits, and the horomes start raging anew, there's no REAL capacity to understand and appreciate what that was all about. The body has to be ready to house and express it. Even if someone had very awake 'facts' about sexuality and its prior impact on their life, this isn't going to matter much until the physical change occurs - although they will understand conversations about the matter, emerging thoughts about the matter, first emerging feelings about the matter way better than others, and it will likely accelerate their sane, informed entry into their sexuality once 'everything's in place.'

The same with soul-growth: Every landmark or threshold is recapitulated based on body maturity, but those who have gone through certain experiences (especially real initiatory transformation) and who have understood certain things will recapitulate more quickly. They will move through the stages more smoothly and often faster.

My best understanding of the Aeons is that they relate to the substantial threshold of adult humanity being stabilized at a different level of the psyche. That is, the Isis Aeon is, I think, best understood as the time when humanity was substantially operating from what we now call subconsciousness, perhaps with just an emerging element of Ruach - much at the level most other mammels, and extending into modern domesticated animals. Every infant goes through this - there is a time before ego-formation is at all stabilized, and that's substantially the same phase. The Osiris Aeon is, I think, best understood as the many-thousand-year period in which the Ruach/ego emerged, formed, took on its mass patterns and developments, and became the prevailing part of the psyche. That is, today an adult human is understood to have a well-developed and functional Ruach. The Aeon of Horus, then, is the multi-millennial period during which adult humanity will stabilize in Neshamah - the K&C of the HGA, as we currently understand it, will be a developmental period in the late teens to late 20s whch marks the ingress to adulthood in the same way that puberty marks the ingress to adolescence. This Aeon is marked by the species having already hit a threshold where a significantly greater number (by which I mean perhaps as large as 3-5%) are having spontaneous cosmic consciousness experiences.

But even when the species hits that new level, there will still need to be the individual biological and psychological evolution through the stages. (Psychology is linked to biology.) Infants will be emerging through Isis; our current "adult" state will be what we see in and expect from teenagers; and by the Saturn return or earlier, there will be a settling into a Neshamah as a natural, stable state.

Or, so I see it.

Frater SOL

^ Thanks for the reply, Jim. You make an excellent point concerning the inability to process energies that one has not yet evolved to assimilate ...I am reminded of the 'shattering of the vessels'.

729

Edward Mason

JAE, 93,

"The Osiris Aeon is, I think, best understood as the many-thousand-year period in which the Ruach/ego emerged, formed, took on its mass patterns and developments, and became the prevailing part of the psyche. That is, today an adult human is understood to have a well-developed and functional Ruach. The Aeon of Horus, then, is the multi-millennial period during which adult humanity will stabilize in Neshamah "

Your own view, then, is that the Aeons are rather lengthier than the "intervals of 2,000 years" Crowley references in his final comments on the Hierophant/Vav in the Book of Thoth (and elsewhere) ?

I ask because the two-millennia idea always bothered me. I think I see the emergence of Ruach consciousness in various places in the Middle East (for example) when they developed their first writing systems, and began building complex architecture. That takes us back 5,000 years, and to say the Pyramids or the Ziggurats were a product of the Aeon of Isis has always struck me as iffy. Julian Jaynes, in The Origins of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind (marvellous prolix title, that) implied the shift happened on a neurological level around 1,200 BC, but that seems like a development, a sub-cycle, not a basic shift.

93 93/93,

Edward

Jim Eshelman

@Edward Mason said

"Your own view, then, is that the Aeons are rather lengthier than the "intervals of 2,000 years" Crowley references in his final comments on the Hierophant/Vav in the Book of Thoth (and elsewhere) ?"

Yes. I characterize that as an estimate.

It's a particularly awkward estimate, since it seems to be quasi-equating the Aeons to the astrological Ages; and in no sense are they the same thing.

Even in the most casual sense, it's easy to see the Osiris aeon - the literal preeminent worship of Osiris included! - as existing at least a thousand years BCE, which means about 3,000 years ago. That's a conservative estimate of the stage in human evolution equating to it.

"I ask because the two-millennia idea always bothered me. I think I see the emergence of Ruach consciousness in various places in the Middle East (for example) when they developed their first writing systems, and began building complex architecture. That takes us back 5,000 years, and to say the Pyramids or the Ziggurats were a product of the Aeon of Isis has always struck me as iffy. Julian Jaynes, in The Origins of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind (marvellous prolix title, that) implied the shift happened on a neurological level around 1,200 BC, but that seems like a development, a sub-cycle, not a basic shift."

I agree.

One can, for example, easily isolate the 5th/6th centuries BCE in Greece as a point where the architecture of the Ruach was well established.

the atlas itch

Hi Jim - I can understand using aeonic succession as a "snapshot" for measuring human evolution. But do you take under consideration the possibility that ancient civilizations might have been far more evolved than our present condition and that, through various cataclysms, human consciousness *devolved *into a primitive state? How do you reconcile our present stage at Ruach with the fact the Tree of Life glyph is found in many ancient cultures - which would presume knowledge of a universal system of consciousness?

Jim Eshelman

@he atlas itch said

"Hi Jim - I can understand using aeonic succession as a "snapshot" for measuring human evolution. But do you take under consideration the possibility that ancient civilizations might have been far more evolved than our present condition and that, through various cataclysms, human consciousness *devolved *into a primitive state?"

That's a tempting theory. I'd like to think it. It plays to my romantic science fiction imagination. The problem is, there's no evidence of it.

There is evidence that some of them were more developed (different idea than "evolved") in certain kinds of technical things (example, the city planning and construction elements on Santorini).

Consider that men like Socrates and Plato were conce considered giants among humanity (even in a developed civilization). They were miraculous leading edge figures in Ruach deveopment, almost super-human illuminati of their time. If they were alive today, they would pass as fairly ordinary college professors.

"How do you reconcile our present stage at Ruach with the fact the Tree of Life glyph is found in many ancient cultures - which would presume knowledge of a universal system of consciousness?"

Is it? Where? Show me a single picture of the Tree of Life before 500 AD.

OTOH there were certainly parallel ways of diagramming similar information. This doesn't mean that humanity in general (in that culture) was of such a level of development, for at least these reasons:

[:21djtj97]The Tree (or whatever parallel image) is a symbol, not a detailed map. The overall pattern can be understood and some of its details intuited without at all having access to those regions.[/21djtj97]
[:21djtj97]A few individuals often have existed who were evolutionarily ahead of the baseline. It only takes one of these to bring through a pattern.[/21djtj97]
[:21djtj97]Allow the possibility that - because this is a symbol, and that layers of it are nested within other layers - that what we see in the pattern today is at a different level than what others saw in similar patterns long ago. For example, a person today who is only awake to Yetzirah will see and understand the Tree of Life in a distinctly different way than one who is also awake to Briah. There is the issue of scale.[/21djtj97]

Besides, the ancients asserted that Kabbalah was delivered to humanity by angels. It also serves my romantic science fiction imagination to think that an entirely different species dropped off some business cards and notepads in humanity's earliest days.

the atlas itch

I’m surprised by your answer since the Cosmic Tree glyph is found in many civilizations:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tree_of_life

The version that really stuck in my mind was the Assyrian stone relief I saw in the Pergamon Museum in Berlin:
www.hermetic.com/egc/images/tree.jpg
www.econ.iastate.edu/classes/econ355/Choi/images/ber060.jpg
www.gutenberg.org/files/16653/16653-h/img/30.jpg

More here:
www.gutenberg.org/files/16653/16653-h/img/29.jpg
www.maravot.com/Phrygian/Ashur.anointing.jpg

Some claim this Assyrian Sacred Tree is the date palm, but the lower part of the Sacred Tree bears little resemblance to the date palm. These Assyrian stone reliefs date to 865 BC.

The Mesoamerican World Tree dates back to approximately 875 – 250 BC:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesoamerican_world_tree
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Izapa_Stela_5

I have not found a satisfactory Tree of Life in the ancient Egyptian civilization – possible candidates might be the acacia, tamarisk, sycamore or lotus – but in the absence of clear archeological evidence I prefer to avoid going down the pseudo-archeological paths of people like Erik von Daniken or Zacharia Sitchens.

Let’s list the other evidence:

The Biblical account of Genesis in which the Elohim (plural – “let us make man in *our *image”) created Adam out of the red earth and placed the Tree of Life in the Garden of Eden.

Plato and Socrates were admittedly giants in terms of Ruach development, but even Plato notes that Egypt was once a colony of Atlantis and that the Egyptians were far older and superior to the Greeks:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanti

In terms of ancient technology, you can find evidence of flying saucers in Hopi religious texts, where they talk about civilizations being destroyed by “flying shields” in previous worlds, or the vimanas, the “chariots of the gods” in the Vedas:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vimana

In the past, I did some research into anthropology, the concept of races and evolution, exploring different ideas on how human species developed. The most convincing theory I found was not the epic Out Of Africa narrative, with its climatic pressures and subsequent differentiation of the three major races, but the notion that human populations have existed in pockets all over the planet and were subject to cataclysms, population decimation, unexpected droughts, cold, so that in the end you have a fragmented picture – somewhere between the Out Of Africa theory and multiregional hypothesis – which makes it hard to map a grand evolutionary narrative on to.

The cultural evidence:

Almost all major religions – Kabbalah, Gnostic, Christian, Buddhist etc – trace the origins of humanity back to some primordial catastrophe/disaster. Call it tzim-tzum, the Fall, entrapment in the material plane, etc. The way I understand this is simply that at some point in humanity’s past a cataclysm or disaster occurred, not that mankind necessarily originated at that point. But even in Kabbalah there are accounts of the creation and destruction of previous worlds, of which the Qlippoth are the remnant shards of energy. The idea of a primordial disaster is deeply imbedded in the memory of the collective unconscious. Humanity is profoundly aware that we are not in an ideal state or world and history is a continual striving toward the ideal. If we started simply from the bottom of the Tree and slowly worked upward, without having any memory of a higher state, we would be living in the best of all possible worlds as Voltaire suggested. Yet the very concept of True Will implies that a person does not fully apprehend their true nature, that one must work toward this.

Jim Eshelman

@he atlas itch said

"I’m surprised by your answer since the Cosmic Tree glyph is found in many civilizations:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tree_of_life

The version that really stuck in my mind was the Assyrian stone relief I saw in the Pergamon Museum in Berlin:
www.hermetic.com/egc/images/tree.jpg "

You said the Tree of Life. They aren't at all the same thing. (Not close.)

I admitted that there were variant diagrams showing some similar things - but not the Tree of Life.

"The Biblical account of Genesis in which the Elohim (plural – “let us make man in *our *image”) created Adam out of the red earth and placed the Tree of Life in the Garden of Eden."

The term "Tree of Life" is used there - but that doesn't mean that what Kabbalists later created and called the "Tree of Life" existed when this was written. In fact, there's no evidence of such a thing for one to two thousand years after Genesis was likely written. (It's well established that the Tree of Life was a technical development later than the Merkabah period of the late 1st C. BCE through early 1st C. CE.)

And if you aren't talking about the standard Kabbalistic/Qabalistic Tree of Life, then your whole point is moot about what was shown to earlier ages in its distinctive form.

"Plato and Socrates were admittedly giants in terms of Ruach development, but even Plato notes that Egypt was once a colony of Atlantis and that the Egyptians were far older and superior to the Greeks:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanti "

He was speaking of Santorini. I cited them for mechanical/technical achievement. (And we must admit that Plato didn't have the best historic records of the whole thing.)

"In terms of ancient technology, you can find evidence of flying saucers in Hopi religious texts, where they talk about civilizations being destroyed by “flying shields” in previous worlds, or the vimanas, the “chariots of the gods” in the Vedas:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vimana "

If flying saucers appeared, it wasn't theirs - it was visitation. There's no reason to presume they had anything like that level of technology.

Etc.

the atlas itch

Rereading your earlier comment on Plato and Socrates I now see we have a different interpretations of these men and what their status would be in our world today. I am inclined to regard their influence on Western metaphysics as unsurpassed even today and that they had knowledge of, or access to, the Supernals. For example, I was reading *Phaedrus the other day and came across Socrates’ following description of the soul:
*
But first of all, let us view the affections and actions of the soul divine and human, and try to ascertain the truth about them. The beginning of our proof is as follows:
The soul through all her being is immortal, for that which is ever in motion is immortal; but that which moves another and is moved by another, in ceasing to move ceases also to live. Only the self-moving, never leaving self, never ceases to move, and is the fountain and beginning of motion to all that moves besides. Now, the beginning is unbegotten, for that which is begotten has a beginning; but the beginning is begotten of nothing, for if it were begotten of something, then the begotten would not come from a beginning. But if unbegotten, it must also be indestructible; for if beginning were destroyed, there could be no beginning out of anything, nor anything out of a beginning; and all things must have a beginning. And therefore the self-moving is the beginning of motion; and this can neither be destroyed nor begotten, else the whole heavens and all creation would collapse and stand still, and never again have motion or birth. But if the self-moving is proved to be immortal, he who affirms that self-motion is the very idea and essence of the soul will not be put to confusion. For the body which is moved from without is soulless; but that which is moved from within has a soul, for such is the nature of the soul. But if this be true, must not the soul be the self-moving, and therefore of necessity unbegotten and immortal? Enough of the soul's immortality.
…….
Would you agree this description of “soul” sounds less like Nephesh and more like Jechidah/Had? Do you disagree that Plato’s famous allegory of the cave is not a retelling of the abyss between the lower and upper realms of the Tree? Or, for example, how about Plato's rejection of the material plane as illusion and pale shadow in the light of the Ideal realm - does this not sound like insight into something beyond Ruach?

Jim Eshelman

@he atlas itch said

"Rereading your earlier comment on Plato and Socrates I now see we have a different interpretations of these men and what their status would be in our world today. I am inclined to regard their influence on Western metaphysics as unsurpassed even today and that they had knowledge of, or access to, the Supernals."

Yeah, we differ then. They got nowhere near the supernals. They were highly developed Ruach which, at the time, made them spiritual giants towering over the those around them.

"For example, I was reading *Phaedrus *the other day and came across Socrates’ following description of the soul: [...]

Would you agree this description of “soul” sounds less like Nephesh and more like Jechidah/Had?"

No, I wouldn't. Not at all. Before getting to the end of the quote and encountering your question, I was thinking that this could have been written by any fairly intelligent, thoughtful person who had actual experience of the World of Yetzirah and understood the nature of the non-material aspect of humanity: "soul" in the sense that the O.T. uses the word nephesh.

"Do you disagree that Plato’s famous allegory of the cave is not a retelling of the abyss between the lower and upper realms of the Tree?"

Absolutely not the Abyss. Nowhere near. It's an allegory of the initiation rite of Malkuth.

"Or, for example, how about Plato's rejection of the material plane as illusion and pale shadow in the light of the Ideal realm - does this not sound like insight into something beyond Ruach?"

No, not at all. It shows insight into something beyond physical substance. It's a routine understanding of an advanced 1=10 of A.'.A.'..

You're giving me insight into many of the questions that fly around this forum and the web in general. The Abyss is freely discussed by people that don't yet have a clue about Tiphereth and often don't have much of a clue of even Yesod. There's no sense of scale. Many don't even have a clue to the realms of consciousness that are possible and, once they get personally blown away by something previously outside their conception, and get a key insight or two or three, they think it sounds like what some book calls a very high state.

Every Sephirah has a whole Tree in it; and I promise you that, at the time I was nearing the end of my 1=10 grade and passed that Abyss which is in the Tree in Malkuth, it felt - from any sense that I had available to me or any idea that I had acquired - like it was "crossing the Abyss." It wasn't. Not THE Abyss. Only a lot of common sense (I knew I was late 1=10 and nowhere near the Abyss!) reinforced by the steady hand of my teacher kept me centered on that one. It was am important step - the spiritual development equivalent of pulling my head out of my ass and noticing there was a sky - and it was the biggest blow-through that I'd experienced to date (well, second biggest come to think of it). But it wasn't what it superficially seemed even though I could match it to every detail of description I'd ever found in some book on the subject. (It was a helluva ride for about a week! )

Mephisto

"Every Sephirah has a whole Tree in it; and I promise you that, at the time I was nearing the end of my 1=10 grade and passed that Abyss which is in the Tree in Malkuth, it felt - from any sense that I had available to me or any idea that I had acquired - like it was "crossing the Abyss." It wasn't. Not THE Abyss. Only a lot of common sense (I knew I was late 1=10 and nowhere near the Abyss!) reinforced by the steady hand of my teacher kept me centered on that one."

Would you say that the opposite happened with Frater Achad, that he took a much lower experience to be that of the Abyss? It seems to be a common problem: someone has Dyhana, or unlocks one of the minor Arcana, and suddenly they think they're some sort of Messiah figure.

Also, if you don't mind, could you be a little more specific about the symptoms of entering Yesod? What changes in consciousness did you experience, and how were you assured of your progress?

the atlas itch

Thanks Jim – that kind of solid feedback is helpful. I realize discussing aspects of the Tree without doing the A.A. gradework can lead to confusion or delusion. In terms of scale, for example, if you agree that Tiphareth/KCHGA is linked with full-blown kundalini illumination that would provide me with a concrete reference point.

I was aware of the Four Worlds of the Tree, but was not aware that each sephiroth contains a Tree within itself – it almost sounds like a chaotic fractal pattern... If you can recommend any books on the Qabalah on how to systematically and practically work with each sephiroth and path, that would be appreciated.. I’m very much interested in the “proofs” by which one knows a sephiroth/grade has been attained and an accurate mapping of the inner planes.