Regardie's level of attainment
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Just out of curiosity, does anyone (cough Jim cough) happen to know what Regardie's degree of attainment was, in any system? (Although seeing an expression in A.'.A.'. or even G.D. terms would be helpful.)
In particular, is it public knowledge whether or not he attained to the K&CHGA?
93, 93/93.
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@Ash said
"93.
Just out of curiosity, does anyone (cough Jim cough) happen to know what Regardie's degree of attainment was, in any system? (Although seeing an expression in A.'.A.'. or even G.D. terms would be helpful.)
In particular, is it public knowledge whether or not he attained to the K&CHGA?"
In Golden Dawn terms, I don't think he ever claimed, or openly accepted, anything higher than 5=6. He did, however, serve as an officer in a 6=5 ceremony. One respected source certified him post mortem as a 7=4, but I think we have to regard that as a formality.
Having known him, can attest to his having a particular mixture of graciousness and manners + quick intolerance of foolishness. I tend to think that these traits would have led him to appreciate the gesture, but take a slightly disdainful look at the whole question of what grade he had. I suspect his p.o.v. would have been that, in the Golden Dawn, having a particular grade meant passing through its ritual, so he might have deigned to acknowledge the 6=5 but not the 7=4.
All that speculation aside...
For the last part of your question, he did say in conversation and in correspondence that he had attained to the K&C of the HGA. He separately said something else on another occassion, and it seems to say the same thing: Though he was received as a Probationer in A.'.A.'., he was never initiated to Neophyte, so held that he had never been "in the A.'.A.'." - but he did say that he had worked its curriculum step by step on his own. (My favorite visit with him included a few minutes when he and I did a "duelling banjos" type of quoting parts of Liber LXV and Liber VII back and forth at each other with ever widening grins.)
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Thank you for the response - exactly what I was looking for.
Jim and Regardie dueling with quotes from the Holy Books... fascinating image, that
I was always under the impression that Regardie had respect for Crowley and Thelema (enough to propagate it), but didn't consider himself actually part of a Thelemic movement in any way.
93, 93/93.
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@Jim Eshelman said
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@Ash said
"93.Just out of curiosity, does anyone (cough Jim cough) happen to know what Regardie's degree of attainment was, in any system? (Although seeing an expression in A.'.A.'. or even G.D. terms would be helpful.)
In particular, is it public knowledge whether or not he attained to the K&CHGA?"
In Golden Dawn terms, I don't think he ever claimed, or openly accepted, anything higher than 5=6. He did, however, serve as an officer in a 6=5 ceremony. One respected source certified him post mortem as a 7=4, but I think we have to regard that as a formality.
Having known him, can attest to his having a particular mixture of graciousness and manners + quick intolerance of foolishness. I tend to think that these traits would have led him to appreciate the gesture, but take a slightly disdainful look at the whole question of what grade he had. I suspect his p.o.v. would have been that, in the Golden Dawn, having a particular grade meant passing through its ritual, so he might have deigned to acknowledge the 6=5 but not the 7=4.
All that speculation aside...
For the last part of your question, he did say in conversation and in correspondence that he had attained to the K&C of the HGA. He separately said something else on another occassion, and it seems to say the same thing: Though he was received as a Probationer in A.'.A.'., he was never initiated to Neophyte, so held that he had never been "in the A.'.A.'." - but he did say that he had worked its curriculum step by step on his own. (My favorite visit with him included a few minutes when he and I did a "duelling banjos" type of quoting parts of Liber LXV and Liber VII back and forth at each other with ever widening grins.)"
Excellent post.
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@Ash said
"93.
Thank you for the response - exactly what I was looking for.
Jim and Regardie dueling with quotes from the Holy Books... fascinating image, that
I was always under the impression that Regardie had respect for Crowley and Thelema (enough to propagate it), but didn't consider himself actually part of a Thelemic movement in any way.
93, 93/93."
In the foreward to the golden dawn he is said to have used the holy books as a tool in bibliomancy during one of his therapy sessions. Also, on the ciceros golden dawn website theres a letter from regardie using the thelemic greetings: do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law, and love is the law, love under will. I never knew what to make of this.
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@armedwithlunchboxes said
"Also, on the ciceros golden dawn website theres a letter from regardie using the thelemic greetings: do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law, and love is the law, love under will. I never knew what to make of this."
It mostly means he was a teacher and had manners. He would use those greetings with Thelemites; and, if you were a Thelemite, he would stop and make a point of telling you that you should use those greetings "because you're a Thelemite."
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@Jim Eshelman said
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@armedwithlunchboxes said
"Also, on the ciceros golden dawn website theres a letter from regardie using the thelemic greetings: do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law, and love is the law, love under will. I never knew what to make of this."It mostly means he was a teacher and had manners. He would use those greetings with Thelemites; and, if you were a Thelemite, he would stop and make a point of telling you that you should use those greetings "because you're a Thelemite.""
I found it interesting because it was in a letter to the H.O.G.D. GA temple discussing the building of the vault of the adepts and the alteration of certain rituals. And in the very next letter he dosent use the greetings.
It must have been a great privilege to know the man. His "the tree of life" has been invaluable to me.
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@kasper81 said
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@Ash said
"93.Just out of curiosity, does anyone (cough Jim cough) happen to know what Regardie's degree of attainment was, in any system? ."
why would you want to know this, if you don't mind me asking?
He seemed to have attained to decent human being grade, but I never knew the guy"
That's the first thing he stated: "out of curiosity."