Initiation and Family
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I had some reservations about posting this as part of me thinks it is a silly question to ask. Are there dangers in going through the process of an Initiating Order to a persons family - the people the person is around most?
What I mean by Initiation is joining an Order, specifically I am referring to the Temple of Thelema, and going through the process and steps of the Order including Initiation and threshholds. I have a wife and a 2 year old and the last thing I would want to do is damage them with things that could be brought upon them. Part of what makes me say this is when reading "Confessions..." of Aleister Crowley there are many instances where the people he was around - wife, friends, servents - went insane in one way or another (Forgive me for not posting specific page numbers). Everyone is different and of course Crowley was going through a transformation that was unique to him.
I know that there are many variables to this and the only way to genuinely know, in all probability, is to either go through the process or to speak with individuals directly to evaluate. Just wondering if anyone has personal experience with this that they would be willing to share.
Thanks.
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I think you always run the risk of creating conflict when you grow or change in any way. Some relationships get pushed apart, abruptly or peacefully, while others emerge, or become more meaningful.
However, I don't think there's anywhere that says it has to be equally traumatic for everyone. It probably depends on how far 'off course' you are when you start. And not everyone chooses to go off the 'deep end' as their own personal form of therapy.
I also think that you run more risk of traumatic upheaval the more you resist and avoid any necessary adjustments.
It reminds me a little of trying to get in shape with exercise. The more out-of-shape you are, the more it hurts to get in shape. But it'll only be worse next year, if the pain scares you away from starting.
Everyone's different, and some need a dramatic change, but the lazy way to tackle it, is to start a gradual, reasonable, regimen and be patient with yourself.
ps Crowley's personal karma was, well, personal
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Av nailed it.
To state it another way: Substitute "therapy" for "initiation" in your question. Is there danger to someone's family of the person goes through very intensive psychotherapy? If so, under what conditions? (I think it is more valuable for me to leave it there - for you to work out the details - rather than flesh them all out myself.)
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Thanks - I understand the correlation in principal. In therapy you have a person leading and protecting you within the confines of the session. In the other situation you may have support of others within a Temple or a personal mentor that serves as a guide and protector. The goal, I gather, being that at some point you become your own guide and protector via your HGA. Can things go wrong? I'd say definatley yes, but that is a natural occurence in any development and a risk I think worth taking. I'd like to think that I practice caution as well, which I guess could be a hinderance, but feels right for right now.
One I understand by experience is the actual developement of the family. Having children changes your lives and your personal mental state. You take on the role of teacher, caregiver, protector, assistant, etc. These things may have not been native to you, but whether you like it or not you are put in these situations. In the process, parts of myself have developed in ways that they may not of if I hadn't gotten married and had a family and our relationship with eachother has evolved. Thus, we've had a transformation of sorts.
The simplicity of this idea is what at first made me think it was silly. However, its a funny thing that happens when you ask questions. Not only do you get insight from others, which was the initial purpose, and which I appreciatively got! You also start the process of answering the question yourself. Many times I think to myself if it is appropriate to ask any questions at all and for this effect I definately think it is worth it and appropriate.
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this is such a great question to me,
i havnt checked this site for over a week, mainly because ive been going through some very deep terrain that has been very consuming and challenging, and it has raised this question within me a number of times....does the Grade work i'm going through effect my Family?....is this right?...is this fair?....and just when i check the site i find the Question already posted.Without a doubt for me it is Yes. But thats because it doesnt matter what i do, it effects my Family, and the more i acknowledge, respond and become responsible with this the better.
Ive thought about this question during other grades i have worked through, and i belive in the way the work of each Grade has brought up deep patterns and trauma that has been played out in my environment. Played out with others, and yes, sometimes my Family. Each time thou i work through it, under all the heat and pressure if i set my intent rite, it grows and i see the way i'm working energetically, what i'm 'holding in place' so to speak.
Another great thing i have realised with all this is a trust in the Intelligence of the Transpersonal, i.e. my families Karma is caught up with mine for a reason. It feels that, the more i accept this the better. The more i do the Great Work, the more this benefits them.
oh...and i'm more and more aware, that its not endless rituals and philisophical ponderings they need, its a man who sets his will and love to grow beauty with them.all the best out there,
evol -
Thanks Evol.
I have not worked through any Grades with any specific Order or System. I am trying to ground myself properly and do some self testing to make sure that I'm up for it. Part of that process has made me ask the questions here on the board and to myself. By chance I came across a site www.speechinthesilence.com that has some podcasts with various lectures and other items. Dr. Shoemaker of COT in Northern California has some interesting things to say here and its good to hear that these concerns are felt by others.
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@mojorisin44 said
"I have not worked through any Grades with any specific Order or System. I am trying to ground myself properly and do some self testing to make sure that I'm up for it. Part of that process has made me ask the questions here on the board and to myself. By chance I came across a site www.speechinthesilence.com that has some podcasts with various lectures and other items. Dr. Shoemaker of COT in Northern California has some interesting things to say here and its good to hear that these concerns are felt by others."
I was thinking about the advice that the Dr. gave on Living Thelema when I read the top of the thread. To echo others , initiations can put us through growth or we can be confronted by things within ourselves which can make our family relations more strained. A personal example: I started to grow and had to start addressing my codependency with my partner.
My recommendation, especially if your mate isn't involved in a similar process, is to talk to them and share what you are going through. Of course, some of it may not be appropriate to share in complete fullness. To learn to hold a secret, to not become lost in detail, and share the wisdom behind an initiation is the point, as I see it, to going through with one.