Life as True Will
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I think I've been coming round to a similar way of experiencing thing.
I used to think that True Will was something you learned and did. But my ideas about True Will are at best just sad caricatures, and at worst, some misguided joke that is completely at-odds with what is really happening.
Life happens, and much of the nature of the events is out of our control. It's shaped by circumstance--the universe outside, and within.
Now I think True Will is kind of something that happens to "us", not by "us".
I think the best that "we" (our thoughts, feelings, and bodies) can do is change our relationship to that True Will, improving our ability to be receptive to it. Learning to be spontaneous, flexible, trusting, and not worrying so much about "what it all means" or whether I'm doing it right. Learning to stop doing things that block that harmony.
Good thoughts, thanks for sharing them.
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@Jason R said
"Can we say True Will is each of our lives?"
I don't think so. Most people, much of the time, are acting seriously at odds with themselves, working at cross purposes to their inherent natures. - Yes, at once level (one very abstracted level), one perhaps ultimately has to admit that every adaptation, defense, distortion, deletion, and misdirection we take is, itself, taken from some deep point that is truth, and that EVENTUALLY works its way through. (Jeffrey Dahmer, for example, probably had a true will involving a need for unbelievably intimate contact; but he was so pathologized that it came out in eating those with whom he would be intimate.) It seems of little value - not meaningful, not setting people in the right direction - to call this an expression of True Will, even though the detours eventually end up at some destination.
"Maybe it is better to understand our Will as not some sort of internal "thing" or even "inclination", but instead as the tendency of our lives."
I broadly agree, but then we'd have to have all sorts of discussions about fine-tuning what we mean. (I suspect you are using "tendency" in a technical sense, and in that sense I probably agree with you mostly.)
It becomes much easier to apply this if we only talk about people who are at a high level of psychological health and freedom; but, absent that, what most people would understand as "the tendency of their lives" is (at best) a distortion of their right momentum.
"As I have said before, I see this whole motion of ones life as their True Will, that whatever one does, all choices, at every moment, IS True Will."
As mentioned above, I might agree with you in the abstract, but disagree at the level of providing anything meaningful, practical, and non-derailing for someone to take into their lives. Though all detours eventually combe back to the main road, I don't think we serve people if we routinely encourage a life of detours. It's just one more example of enabling behavior. Now, if somebody wants to go sight-seeing on a side road, that's a different matter. But I think we need to give people definitions that give them the option of being on their own "main road" as much of the time as they choose.
"Life does not ALLOW us this in reality."
It often allows it for a long time. Yes, some people have a hard time not learning the lessons they stubbornly resist, and life cranks up the volume each time we don't "hear the message." But a lot of people take a lot of beating down before they crumble, cave in, and get the message.
If they are interested, their path can be made easier.
"We are pushed along specific routes that ALWAYS force us to follow universal principles, happiness, satisfaction, and reward, the tools of life, that keep us on track."
Eventually. Eventually. (And, therefore, I wouldn't say "keep us on track." Most people don't stay on track. I'd say "...that returns us to the track eventually.")
"These inclinations are NOT True Will however alone, it is the unity of these with the inclinations of your environment, your life that constitute your True Will."
Correct. Yes, exactly. Nature and nurture are united, collaborating in continually creating us. - Or, to say it a different way: It's all driven by aspects of yourself, but you have to recognize that what you call "other people" and "your environment" are aspects of yourself.
"The real way to understand life, the only way it works beautifully together, and makes sense, is to understand it has a higher spiritual aspect. That this divine underlying foundation brings it all into a hidden harmony, in which every minute detail moves in unison, although it may appear disconnected and chaotic from a limited perspective."
In this, we agree!
(I might soften "only.")As I wrote yesterday, Life is the REAL Choas Magick. Nothing else compares with the whole of life when it comes to Chaos!
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@Avshalom Binyamin said
"I used to think that True Will was something you learned and did."
Not "learn." - "Discover."
"I think the best that "we" (our thoughts, feelings, and bodies) can do is change our relationship to that True Will, improving our ability to be receptive to it. Learning to be spontaneous, flexible, trusting, and not worrying so much about "what it all means" or whether I'm doing it right. Learning to stop doing things that block that harmony."
Yes.
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@Jim Eshelman said
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@Jason R said
"Can we say True Will is each of our lives?"I don't think so. Most people, much of the time, are acting seriously at odds with themselves, working at cross purposes to their inherent natures. - Yes, at once level (one very abstracted level), one perhaps ultimately has to admit that every adaptation, defense, distortion, deletion, and misdirection we take is, itself, taken from some deep point that is truth, and that EVENTUALLY works its way through. (Jeffrey Dahmer, for example, probably had a true will involving a need for unbelievably intimate contact; but he was so pathologized that it came out in eating those with whom he would be intimate.) It seems of little value - not meaningful, not setting people in the right direction - to call this an expression of True Will, even though the detours eventually end up at some destination.
"Maybe it is better to understand our Will as not some sort of internal "thing" or even "inclination", but instead as the tendency of our lives."
I broadly agree, but then we'd have to have all sorts of discussions about fine-tuning what we mean. (I suspect you are using "tendency" in a technical sense, and in that sense I probably agree with you mostly.)
It becomes much easier to apply this if we only talk about people who are at a high level of psychological health and freedom; but, absent that, what most people would understand as "the tendency of their lives" is (at best) a distortion of their right momentum.
"As I have said before, I see this whole motion of ones life as their True Will, that whatever one does, all choices, at every moment, IS True Will."
As mentioned above, I might agree with you in the abstract, but disagree at the level of providing anything meaningful, practical, and non-derailing for someone to take into their lives. Though all detours eventually combe back to the main road, I don't think we serve people if we routinely encourage a life of detours. It's just one more example of enabling behavior. Now, if somebody wants to go sight-seeing on a side road, that's a different matter. But I think we need to give people definitions that give them the option of being on their own "main road" as much of the time as they choose.
"Life does not ALLOW us this in reality."
It often allows it for a long time. Yes, some people have a hard time not learning the lessons they stubbornly resist, and life cranks up the volume each time we don't "hear the message." But a lot of people take a lot of beating down before they crumble, cave in, and get the message.
If they are interested, their path can be made easier.
"We are pushed along specific routes that ALWAYS force us to follow universal principles, happiness, satisfaction, and reward, the tools of life, that keep us on track."
Eventually. Eventually. (And, therefore, I wouldn't say "keep us on track." Most people don't stay on track. I'd say "...that returns us to the track eventually.")
"These inclinations are NOT True Will however alone, it is the unity of these with the inclinations of your environment, your life that constitute your True Will."
Correct. Yes, exactly. Nature and nurture are united, collaborating in continually creating us. - Or, to say it a different way: It's all driven by aspects of yourself, but you have to recognize that what you call "other people" and "your environment" are aspects of yourself.
"The real way to understand life, the only way it works beautifully together, and makes sense, is to understand it has a higher spiritual aspect. That this divine underlying foundation brings it all into a hidden harmony, in which every minute detail moves in unison, although it may appear disconnected and chaotic from a limited perspective."
In this, we agree!
(I might soften "only.")As I wrote yesterday, Life is the REAL Choas Magick. Nothing else compares with the whole of life when it comes to Chaos!"
93 Jim,
Thank you Jim, I appreciate your thoughts. However, cant we understand these others at "odds" as necessary to the greater scope of social growth? I feel it is reasonable to apply our personal situation of growth, self discovery etc., in a broader aspect as well, one of course is the Aeon. So, why is it not acceptable that even the "crazies", like Hitler, in fact SERVE this whole process. Nothing is useless, nothing really at "odds", but instead a natural by-product and aspect of THAT stage in social growth, of which WE (you) are a part? In other words, these things we are at odds with, this friction itself IS the process in action. Although there of course are better routes, who can say this is not part of the necessary work? Even more so, if we consider reincarnation, and our "part" within a particular time, social order, environment, etc. it becomes even more pertinent.
I'm seeing perhaps a change in my view of what we call even "happiness" and "harmony", perhaps we are so obsessed and fixated on "peace" and "pleasure", that we are in fact missing the real gold. The REAL worth may be in conflict and resistance, and challenges, in that these things bring change, and force us to face realities and truths, and universal principles. We all know the dangers of being too cozy, or satisfied with themselves, falling into perhaps some illusion we are "perfect", and without fault, that we are in "in touch with ourselves", when in fact, maybe we NEVER are, yet that's just it! This Dhukka, this inherent imperfection drives our interaction, the engine of life. Of course balance! We should not SEEK or admire conflict, but simply understand THAT is the state of "perfection" in reality.
The fallacy of some perfected "way", or blissful life - thats in harmony with our "authentic, True nature" and will open our lives to happiness is perhaps getting in our way? Maybe we need to see imperfection, and our confusion even, our humanity, as something to be accepted, embraced, relieved of guilt or fear of failing with. Let go of fear of failing to "discover" ourselves, and instead seek to strengthen ourselves in universal aspects we all agree have benifits, should be our real aim; for example, discipline, honesty, integrity, honor, physical fitness, intelligence, etc. etc., THEN each individuals unique personality and talents or apptitudes are strengthened. No "true nature" is "discovered" really, but life is empowered by their overall strengthening in positive attributes? Or something along these lines. Maybe these imperfections ARE, in fact part OF who we are?
We then, in effect, are swimming with the current of the universal Will when we are at odds? We do not worry about others doing this, as we can simply understand them as the figurative "slaves" that serve, the flora and fauna of the times, aspects a particular stage in social growth, and tools playing a role in the greater Will to push all onward. To me, all the magickal work amounts to tools sharpening particular principles, we apply to our already existing qualities anyway, really. Mediation - strengthens concentration, adorations, study, ritual, all benifit imagination, self discipline, intelligence, etc., all that serve to fortify and magnify the latent mixture of personality traits and talents, AND strengthen then our potency to the greater universal Will, our True Will.
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@Avshalom Binyamin said
"I think I've been coming round to a similar way of experiencing thing.
I used to think that True Will was something you learned and did. But my ideas about True Will are at best just sad caricatures, and at worst, some misguided joke that is completely at-odds with what is really happening.
Life happens, and much of the nature of the events is out of our control. It's shaped by circumstance--the universe outside, and within.
Now I think True Will is kind of something that happens to "us", not by "us".
I think the best that "we" (our thoughts, feelings, and bodies) can do is change our relationship to that True Will, improving our ability to be receptive to it. Learning to be spontaneous, flexible, trusting, and not worrying so much about "what it all means" or whether I'm doing it right. Learning to stop doing things that block that harmony.
Good thoughts, thanks for sharing them.
"Oops! I guess my response to you didn't actually post somehow! I forget now exactly what I said, but I mentioned that I noticed that actually the BOL doesn't directly mention any HGA (except what we take as this symbolically) or, anything like the common idea of TW. I'm glad you liked it. Thank you!
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HGA isn't a distinctly Thelemic matter. It has been explicitly in the Western traditions from Medieval times, in the Eastern traditions (under other names, e.g., Ishvara) for much longer, and in most traditions worldwide (under some form or another - often not explicit or clearly formulated) as far back as we can trace.
I think it wasn't necessary to mention in Liber L., since it wasn't a distinct innovation.
OTOH each of the main deities in Liber L. is also a metaphor for the HGA, representing a particular aspect or expression etc. So, indirectly, it's there. (Soror Meral used to be quite emphatic - and IMHO correct! - that Ra-Hoor-Khuit, as the visible object of worship, is quite explicitly a "stand-in" for the HGA.)
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@Jim Eshelman said
"HGA isn't a distinctly Thelemic matter. It has been explicitly in the Western traditions from Medieval times, in the Eastern traditions (under other names, e.g., Ishvara) for much longer, and in most traditions worldwide (under some form or another - often not explicit or clearly formulated) as far back as we can trace.
I think it wasn't necessary to mention in Liber L., since it wasn't a distinct innovation.
OTOH each of the main deities in Liber L. is also a metaphor for the HGA, representing a particular aspect or expression etc. So, indirectly, it's there. (Soror Meral used to be quite emphatic - and IMHO correct! - that Ra-Hoor-Khuit, as the visible object of worship, is quite explicitly a "stand-in" for the HGA.)"
I see. Yes, I remember you had mentioned that Ra Hoor Khuit was the Thelemic stand in for the HGA. It makes sense to me, yet, still when I'm thinking freely, and question it "objectively" it does stand out. The main interest is however, that our standard idea of TW, etc., doesn't seem as clear cut and precisely explained in Liber L. We can interpret it as such, but its not definitively there, id say.
I always found it interesting, for example, that discovering, or doing ones TW would in effect be a change. We theoretically, after conversing with the HGA, and falling in line with our True Will would change us, yet in the Book of the Law, we are told in a few ways not to change, saying "Yea! deem not of change: ye shall be as ye are, & not other." Also it says "He that is righteous shall be righteous still; he that is filthy shall be filthy still." Of course "There is none that shall be cast down or lifted up: all is ever as it was." These words seem to imply that the illusion we "change" or are aligned with some TW as we regularly see it is off. If there were a TW inside us we could "fail" to discover, why does it mock those who "fail" saying "Doest thou fail? Art thou sorry? Is fear in thine heart?" We know that "There is success." Now, trust me, I realize you know a lot more than I, and I can hardly claim to know everything, these are things I'm struggling with, and questioning as of late. I appreciate all the feedback.
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@Jason R said
"The main interest is however, that our standard idea of TW, etc., doesn't seem as clear cut and precisely explained in Liber L. We can interpret it as such, but its not definitively there, id say."
That's also not a new idea from Liber L. The concept of True Will pre-existed it, in monastic Christianity, for a millennium. Liber L. just brought the point front and center, and created a new context for understanding it.
"We theoretically, after conversing with the HGA, and falling in line with our True Will"
BTW, sometimes it happens that way, and sometimes it happens the other way around.
".. would change us, yet in the Book of the Law, we are told in a few ways not to change, saying "Yea! deem not of change: ye shall be as ye are, & not other."
"
Notice, from the syntax, that it doesn't instructed not to change. We are advised not to expect change. (I find this verse most useful in talking about our attitudes toward change in other people; but I'm sure that's not the whole of it.)Of course there's change - nothing but change! - in surface phenomenon. Circumstances change. Impermanent things move through their life cycles. But what you truly are beneath those shifting condition does not change.
(Jason... Well, James too. lol)