Golden Dawn and A.'.A.'. Grades
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Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law.
My search queries were reduced to fewer terms than I would have liked and I didn't have much luck turning up any information specifically addressing what I've made this thread for.
I believe I've seen it mentioned here a few times, but it may actually have been in my readings, that there is a correspondence between some G.D. Grades and some Grades of the A.A. If my memory recalls correctly, it was almost as if there were a lot of similarities between the Adepthood of the G.D. and the Lower Grades of the Order of the G.D. in the A.A.
I don't really care that much about the Golden Dawn, but I'd like to add as much depth as I possibly can to my understanding of the Order of the G.D., as that's where I see myself dealing the most in my Student period.
Love is the law, love under will.
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@Zalthos said
"My search queries were reduced to fewer terms than I would have liked and I didn't have much luck turning up any information specifically addressing what I've made this thread for.
I believe I've seen it mentioned here a few times, but it may actually have been in my readings, that there is a correspondence between some G.D. Grades and some Grades of the A.A. If my memory recalls correctly, it was almost as if there were a lot of similarities between the Adepthood of the G.D. and the Lower Grades of the Order of the G.D. in the A.A.
I don't really care that much about the Golden Dawn, but I'd like to add as much depth as I possibly can to my understanding of the Order of the G.D., as that's where I see myself dealing the most in my Student period."
"Correspondence" probably isn't the right word, but I get what you're asking. Parallels in the stages of development can be found.
I don't know if you have my book Visions & Voices. In Chapter 2, I devote several pages to this exact subject (after setting it up with prior sections). The main point I make is that the most useful basis for assessing one's inner development is the Four Worlds.
@Visions & Voices said
"The most meaningful and useful way to understand the differences of scale of these two systems is to examine them not in terms of the sephiroth but, rather, in terms of the Four Worlds described earlier. In working for decades with students in diverse and often overlapping training systems, the Four Worlds model has been the best framework for understanding gradient spiritual progress. Within this, the sephiroth are useful for a more granular system, and their symbolism adds richness to the whole. But the climactic, breakthrough levels – the real grade differences – are found in successive opening to each of the Four Worlds."
Think of each stage in each of these systems (or, for that matter, any other systems you want to cross-compare) as operating primarily in one of the Four Worlds, and aspiring to / working at opening consciously to the next one.
In the G.D. model, the First Order (0=0 through 4=7) is in Assiah. The Second Order (beginning with 5=6) opens to, and begins actively working with, Yetzirah. Had there ever been an authentic opening to 8=3 in the G.D. system, it would have been an opening to Briah.
In the A.'.A.'. model, the First Order (which operates in Assiah while working to open itself to Yetzirah) is the 1=10 Grade. The Second Order (and stable operation within Yetzirah) begins at 2=9. The Briatic level starts at 5=6.
That's the gist of it.
Except, there are other points of view that seem to contradict the simplicity of the above. Primarily, the distinction here is that the G.D. is a "work backwards" system (i.e., being "in" a grade means you get the grade initiation and title first, then do the work to establish yourself there), while the A.'.A.'. is a "work foreward" system (i.e., being "in" a grade means you have already done the work to establish yourself there, and the conferral of the title is a formal recognition that "you've arrived"). For example, the Assiatic A.'.A.'. 1=10 (its FIrst Order) is doing the work of opening to "the astral," journeying therein, and undertaking magical work that acknowledges (and is progressively conscious in) the World of Yetzirah - all working to bridge from Assiah to Yetzirah. But the Yetziratic G.D. Second Order (beginning with 5=6) is doing the same thing: being already nominally a Yetziratic grade, the 5=6 is then doing the same astral and ceremonial sorts of work to establish themselves therein.
So, the better assessment is to say that the entire A.'.A.'. corresponds to the Second Order (and beyond) of the G.D. (I exclude the Probationer Grade which, which isn't technically "in" the A.'.A.'..)
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Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law.
@Jim Eshelman said
"In the A.'.A.'. model, the First Order (which operates in Assiah while working to open itself to Yetzirah) is the 1=10 Grade. The Second Order (and stable operation within Yetzirah) begins at 2=9. The Briatic level starts at 5=6."
Solid gold! Thanks for that one.
This whole bit about the Four Worlds has really got me realing.
I'm fascinated by the information that you've laid out about them in the context of the A.'.A.'. model, particularly how they highlight the Middle Pillar as they do, and the whole idea that all the Sephiroth exist simultaneously in all four worlds.Not to mention the wide array of "fours" that stick out like sore thumbs here, principally to me being: the Aeons, the Formula of Tetragrammaton, and the very Elements themselves.
I've been reading Ouspensky's Tertium Organum lately. Have you ever read it? In it, Ouspensky elaborates on Hinton's ideas about the Fourth Dimension and deduces that time is actually a property of space, the fourth property of the traditional three-dimensional axis of perceivable sensory phenomena. I haven't finished it yet, but its getting into this idea that an idea of a ubiquitously permeating Eternity is essential to every conceivable understanding of Time.
I don't mean to derail the thread; I do think the above may have some bearing (at least, in the framework of my own mind) to the following question:
If the Four Worlds do have such a direct correspondence to Tetragrammaton, what is rendered at the inclusion of Spirit (shin) in the Four Worlds? Is this Qabalistically represented by the Ain Soph Aur?
Love is the law, love under will.
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@Zalthos said
"If the Four Worlds do have such a direct correspondence to Tetragrammaton, what is rendered at the inclusion of Spirit (shin) in the Four Worlds? Is this Qabalistically represented by the Ain Soph Aur?"
I wrote a long, rambling answer to this, and then - as I was ready to click Submit - a better answer was dropped into my mind.
It is this: Spirit isn't a "fifth thing," a higher element in the sense that Fire is transcendent to Water. Spirit is in the balanced integration of all the parts. In terms of the elements in the Microcosm, that means one thing; but in the pattern of the Four Worlds, I don't know that it means anything different. The fulfillment of the Great Work is in the simultaneous vibration of a single Word in all Four Worlds at once. An all-Atziluthic being isn't capable of fulfilling the Great Work - it requires more. That balanced integration, that 'simultaneous' vibration of a single tone in all Four Worlds, is, I think, the idea for which you're looking.
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Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law.
@Jim Eshelman said
"Spirit isn't a "fifth thing," a higher element in the sense that Fire is transcendent to Water. Spirit is in the balanced integration of all the parts. In terms of the elements in the Microcosm, that means one thing; but in the pattern of the Four Worlds, I don't know that it means anything different. The fulfillment of the Great Work is in the simultaneous vibration of a single Word in all Four Worlds at once. An all-Atziluthic being isn't capable of fulfilling the Great Work - it requires more. That balanced integration, that 'simultaneous' vibration of a single tone in all Four Worlds, is, I think, the idea for which you're looking."
That's exactly the idea I'm looking for.
Do you elaborate on this in any of your books? I'm purchasing them in the order you wrote them, and presently looking forward to Mystical and Magical System arriving at my doorstep in the coming days.
Even as I go back to cap III of Magick in Theory and Practice, there's already a lot more subtle and suggestive information that wasn't there before I had this basic grasp on the Four Worlds that I'm getting.
I took a peak around Solunars, too, and I just may be getting some of your books on astrology. I particularly like the basic information you made available about the planets at Solunars.
Love is the law, love under will.
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@Zalthos said
"Do you elaborate on this in any of your books?"
What part? (There are bits and pieces scattered throughout, but not, say, a section directed right at this point.) The main part of my last answer was something I didn't know until I was writing your answer. (I get help as needed.) The A.'.A.'. book touches on the Worlds phenomenon (almost in passing) throughout, and V&V incorporates it into a larger introductory framework.
Mostly, the direct access to the type of information above is gained by passing through the degrees of Temple of Thelema.
"I'm purchasing them in the order you wrote them, and presently looking forward to Mystical and Magical System arriving at my doorstep in the coming days."
Thank you.
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Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law.
@Jim Eshelman said
"What part?"
Principally this:
@Jim Eshelman said
"Spirit is in the balanced integration of all the parts. ... The fulfillment of the Great Work is in the simultaneous vibration of a single Word in all Four Worlds at once. ... That balanced integration, that 'simultaneous' vibration of a single tone in all Four Worlds, is, I think, the idea for which you're looking."
I'm mostly concerned about the "word" you speak of. I would assume it to be ABRAHADABRA, but I don't want to jump to any conclusions. Honestly, now that you've said the main part of your last answer was something you didn't know until you were writing that answer, I won't expect much more in regards to further clarification; you've really already done more for me than I could've hoped for, anyways.
Love is the law, love under will.
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@Zalthos said
"
@Jim Eshelman said
"What part?"Principally this:
@Jim Eshelman said
"Spirit is in the balanced integration of all the parts. ... The fulfillment of the Great Work is in the simultaneous vibration of a single Word in all Four Worlds at once. ... That balanced integration, that 'simultaneous' vibration of a single tone in all Four Worlds, is, I think, the idea for which you're looking."
I'm mostly concerned about the "word" you speak of. I would assume it to be ABRAHADABRA, but I don't want to jump to any conclusions. Honestly, now that you've said the main part of your last answer was something you didn't know until you were writing that answer, I won't expect much more in regards to further clarification; you've really already done more for me than I could've hoped for, anyways."
The "Spirit is source/integration of the parts" is basic to Hindu doctrine of the tattwas, alchemical principles overall, and the traditional Qabalistic paths of initiation. (One isn't likely to really understand it until one has passed through the four elemental attunement stages and reaches the Portal grade. That specific path through the symbols really zonks this in.)
I didn't know the rest until I was answering your question (and, even then, didn't know it until I had cleared my brain by dumping its feces onto the screen - at which point the better answer was given to me).
By "the Word" I mean the primary impulse of your being - your unique and immortal Word, the single and ONLY vibration that moves through what fundamentally defines and distinguishes you from any other point in the body of Nuit.