Daath and Tipharet
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@Metzareph said
"Knowledge is another way to say "sexual intercourse"?
"Both "knowledge" and "conversation" are older English terms for "sexual intercourse." These usages were contemporary to the writing of the Abramelin works. The former survives primarily in the phrase, "carnal knowledge," and the allusion to "knowing in a Biblical way." When the Old Testament says (for example), "Adam knew Eve," we all know that means, "Adam fucked Eve," and in fact the word is an appropriate grammatical variant of daath. The word in Hebrew had the dual meaning (hence my insistence that Daath is the union of Chokmah and Binah, Shiva and Shakti compulating, etc.).
If you check The American Heritage Dictiionary for "know," you will still find, as an archaic definition, "To have sexual intercourse with." Under "knowledge," it still gives the definition, "Carnal knowledge," without suggesting it is archaic. Looking up "conversation" in the same dictionary, the etymology section appends, "Used as a synonym for 'sexual intercourse' from at least 1511, hence criminal conversation, legal term for adultery from late 18c."
"BTW, in one old Golden Dawn book, I read that according to the Zohar the current Tree of Life was preceded by another one where Daath existed and had paths connecting to the other sephiroth. I've seen mentioned that sometimes Kether was eliminated (according to Moses ben Jacob Cordovero) but I'm really not a scholar. I guess what interests me is the psychological transformation of knowledge, union and sexual intercourse."
That's misleading. The GD showed this "older" Tree in 3=8 as reality in the Garden of Eden, and perhaps marked it as "earlier" because it preceeded in their grade structure the Tree we use, which they designated as "after the Fall." But what's misleading is that 3=8 diagram shows a Tree that first appeared centuries later than the one we normally use. It seems to me that the 3-8 version is more of an "intellectual ideal," and the 4=7 is more an an "emotional reality."
"Two other things that I wanted to mention... to cross from Chesed to Binah, you have to travel using the "Old Paths" meaning the paths from the previous Tree."
Aside from the fact that it isn't really a 'previous' Tree...
If you do it that way, you give up the symbolism of crossing the Abyss. Read "One Star in Sight" on the three tasks for an Exempt Adept to become a Master of the Temple. One is assigned to Zayin (opening to Binah from Tiphereth); one to Cheth (opening to Binah form Geburah); and then comes the task of crossing the Abyss which is opening to Binah from Chesed for which there is no path. The absence of a path is, itself, a potent symbol of the experience.
FWIW there are also the 16 "Hidden Paths" of the Tree, so you don't need to go to the bastard Lurianic Tree for this.
"Since it is not really possible to cross from Chesed to Binah, you may have to go back to the middle pillar... to Tiphareth to cross the Daleth path, but I don't really know."
Are, you are soooo close. If you go back to the Middle Pillar... it isn't Dalth you end up crossing. It's Gimel that becomes indistinguishable from Binah in some respects. (See the documents in the A.'.A.'. 7=4 curriculum, especially Liber Os Abysmi. They as much as say this is so. See the section "The Path of Zayin" in Chapter 11 of The Mystical & Magical System of the A.'.A.'..)
"The other thing is the use of the word "knowledge". It seems to me that in this case, it represents just the accumulation of information without actually making it part of oneself. Once this data has become part of the individual, understanding gives meaning. In other words, Choronzon is just "yottabytes" of information that don't make sense or don't have any purpose, but then again, I don't really know...
"Remember the chief distinction of cognitive processes above and below the Abyss. Below the Abyss, opposites are pereceived to be distinct, separate. Above the Abyss, opposites are perceived as being united. This is a consequence of the shift in consciousness. So the outer face of Da'ath is that it is the apex of the Ruach, the highest development (developed almost to infinite lengths) of the intellect. If one adheres to below-the-abyss consciousness, this will truly lead to insanity (all knowledge available at once, perceived as separate unites infinitely diversified, leads to utter dissipation). But if one makes the shift to above-the-Abyss consciousness, profane knowledge becomes gnosis. Daath then serves its function as the access point to the Supernals.
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@Jim Eshelman said
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@Metzareph said
""BTW, in one old Golden Dawn book, I read that according to the Zohar the current Tree of Life was preceded by another one where Daath existed and had paths connecting to the other sephiroth. I've seen mentioned that sometimes Kether was eliminated (according to Moses ben Jacob Cordovero) but I'm really not a scholar. I guess what interests me is the psychological transformation of knowledge, union and sexual intercourse."
That's misleading. The GD showed this "older" Tree in 3=8 as reality in the Garden of Eden, and perhaps marked it as "earlier" because it preceeded in their grade structure the Tree we use, which they designated as "after the Fall." But what's misleading is that 3=8 diagram shows a Tree that first appeared centuries later than the one we normally use. It seems to me that the 3-8 version is more of an "intellectual ideal," and the 4=7 is more an an "emotional reality.""
"Wow, yes! thanks for clarifying this "earlier" thing. I got it now.
@Jim Eshelman said
"
"Two other things that I wanted to mention... to cross from Chesed to Binah, you have to travel using the "Old Paths" meaning the paths from the previous Tree."Aside from the fact that it isn't really a 'previous' Tree...
If you do it that way, you give up the symbolism of crossing the Abyss. Read "One Star in Sight" on the three tasks for an Exempt Adept to become a Master of the Temple. One is assigned to Zayin (opening to Binah from Tiphereth); one to Cheth (opening to Binah form Geburah); and then comes the task of crossing the Abyss which is opening to Binah from Chesed for which there is no path. The absence of a path is, itself, a potent symbol of the experience.
FWIW there are also the 26 "Hidden Paths" of the Tree, so you don't need to go to the bastard Lurianic Tree for this. "
Jim, can you expound on the Lurianic Tree? I'm not familiar with it.
@Jim Eshelman said
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"Since it is not really possible to cross from Chesed to Binah, you may have to go back to the middle pillar... to Tiphareth to cross the Daleth path, but I don't really know."Are, you are soooo close. If you go back to the Middle Pillar... it isn't Dalth you end up crossing. It's Gimel that becomes indistinguishable from Binah in some respects. (See the documents in the A.'.A.'. 7=4 curriculum, especially Liber Os Abysmi. They as much as say this is so. See the section "The Path of Zayin" in Chapter 11 of The Mystical & Magical System of the A.'.A.'..)"
Thank you Jim.
@Jim Eshelman said
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"The other thing is the use of the word "knowledge". It seems to me that in this case, it represents just the accumulation of information without actually making it part of oneself. Once this data has become part of the individual, understanding gives meaning. In other words, Choronzon is just "yottabytes" of information that don't make sense or don't have any purpose, but then again, I don't really know..."Remember the chief distinction of cognitive processes above and below the Abyss. Below the Abyss, opposites are pereceived to be distinct, separate. Above the Abyss, opposites are perceived as being united. This is a consequence of the shift in consciousness. So the outer face of Da'ath is that it is the apex of the Ruach, the highest development (developed almost to infinite lengths) of the intellect. If one adheres to below-the-abyss consciousness, this will truly lead to insanity (all knowledge available at once, perceived as separate unites infinitely diversified, leads to utter dissipation). But if one makes the shift to above-the-Abyss consciousness, profane knowledge becomes gnosis. Daath then serves its function as the access point to the Supernals."
I'll try to remember this when I'm crossing the Abyss. (doubtfully in this lifetime)
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@Metzareph said
"Jim, can you expound on the Lurianic Tree? I'm not familiar with it."
It's the basis of the one you were talking about before, essentially with the Middle Pillar "shoved up a notch." Named after Rabbi Luria, also called The Gra.
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@Jim Eshelman said
"FWIW there are also the 16 "Hidden Paths" of the Tree, so you don't need to go to the bastard Lurianic Tree for this.
"Jim, I know the PFC first pointed out these paths. Do you know if there's a publicly available resource discussing them?
Dan
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@ar said
"
@Jim Eshelman said
"FWIW there are also the 16 "Hidden Paths" of the Tree, so you don't need to go to the bastard Lurianic Tree for this.
"Jim, I know the PFC first pointed out these paths. Do you know if there's a publicly available resource discussing them?"
I know of nothing in English and in print.
But the concept is really simple: There are "hidden paths" (if one spoke neurologically, one might call them "potential paths") between any two Sephioth not already connected unless there's something else in the way.
Thus, 10 and 9 each connects also to 5 & 4, and 3 & 2. 8 connects to 2 and 1, as 7 to 3 and 1. 5 connects to 2 & 1 and 4 to 3 & 1. (That's 16. I see a made a typo before which I'll go back and correct.)
Note that in the Path of Return these don't even become an issue until 6=5. That is, until the Adeptus Minor begins opening the channels to Geburah, hidden paths opening Malkuth and Yesod to Geburah have no purpose.
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@Jim Eshelman said
"(That's 16. I see a made a typo before which I'll go back and correct.)"
Ah, I see. I couldn't get to 26, either.
Is there anything along the lines of the 32 paths of wisdom dealing with the hidden paths? One could meditate on the connecting Sephiroth and get some idea the kind of "Consciousness" defines each path, I suppose...
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@ar said
"Is there anything along the lines of the 32 paths of wisdom dealing with the hidden paths? One could meditate on the connecting Sephiroth and get some idea the kind of "Consciousness" defines each path, I suppose..."
I think the most important characteristic is that they have no assigned correspondences or official characteristics. They aren't part of a "defined set" of anything. That means the only thing we know about them is that they open from one particular Sephirah to another.
In practice of ascending the Tree, I'll give an example of how this seems to work, though. As one moves toward a new grade, there is (at least in my experience; and there are some notes that suggest it was true in Crowley's) a sense where the new Sephirah has to be attuned to at the physical body level first (cells change). After this, it happens next at a psychological level. In the earlier grades, this might get missed because it is so part of the visible pattern, but when, say, one moves from 6=5 to 7=4 the only visible paths to be covered are Kaph, Yod, and Teth.
The experience, though, is that Malkuth first has to open to, attune to, adjust to Chesed; and since there is no path, the invisible path allows a way to describe the process. Then come the changes in basic psychological pattern, as Yesod opens to Chesed. Hod's opening has no direct path (though from 32 Paths we know of a unique relationship between Hod and Chesed whereby the former traces back to the latter). This completed, Netzach opens to Chesed as the Path of Kaph is worked... and "it's on."
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@Metzareph said
"Jim, can you expound on the Lurianic Tree? I'm not familiar with it."
We discussed it before, at:
www.heruraha.net/viewtopic.php?t=2802
At the time I gave two pointers to illustrations of it on the web.
Basically it adds two diagonal paths Binah-Chesed and Chokmah-Geburah (through Da'ath) and omits the paths from Netsach and Hod to Malkuth. The lettering of the paths is re-sorted so the three "mother" letters, 'aleph, mem and shin, correspond to the three horizontal paths; the seven double letters to the seven vertical paths (in the three pillars) and the twelve simple letters to the diagonal paths.
Jim expressed his view at the time and for what it's worth, I agree; the fit (at least at a superficial level) is too neat to be anything but artificial
This seems to be the version of the Tree promoted by The Kabbalah Center (<!-- w --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.kabbalah.com">www.kabbalah.com</a><!-- w -->) which, with its most famous adherent, Madonna, has been responsible for a popular/populist resurgence of interest in Kabbalah-with-a-K (which some like to distinguish from Qabalah-with-a-Qoph)*.
OP
- rather off-topic but I was playing with <!-- w --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.googlefight.com">www.googlefight.com</a><!-- w --> the other day, and one of my "contests" was to rate Kabbalah against Qabalah and Cabbala. K won hands down.
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Do What Thou Wilt Shall Be The Whole Of The Law
Hello,
I will offer a different take on your question.
@Metzareph said
"I'm curious about the similar Hebrew name that is used for Daath and Tipharet that involves "Knowledge". Do you know why this is?"
I have a somewhat different perspective here... I do not have the negative impression of the system of the Holy ARI (Elohi Rabbi Izaak - "The G_dly Rabbi Isaac") that is quite pervasive here. Personally I was led into a Thelemic paradigm by my work with this system (although in its "heretical" form) in conjunction with the system of the G.'.D.'.
In Zoharic or Lurianic Kabbalah the Partzufim take precedence over the Sephiroth. Zaur Anpin or Microprosopus being the Collectivity of Sephiroth 4-9 (4-10 when conjoined with his female counterpart – "Nukba") is "Animated" by Da'ath. The Seven Lower Sephiroth of the Sovereign Edifice are termed "Middot" or "Measures" referring to the "Attributes" of the Divine and Nameless One. The Supernal Sephiroth are considered "Mochin" meaning "Mental Powers", "Mentalities", or quite literally "Brains" (note: the Names Wisdom, Understanding, and Knowledge as distinguished from Mercy, Severity, etc). The Supernals manifest as the "Mochin" in Zaur Anpin through Da'ath and form the entire "Inner Light" of the Partzuf, Zaur Anpin. Kether means "Crown" as it "Encircles" the Tree and is thus not actually a part of it. Achievement of Da'ath by the issuance of the "Mochin" into Microprosopus is what is referred to in the Hermetic Orders as Kether. (ie in the G.'.D.'. the descent of the letter Shin via Da'ath).
The Lurianic system is a focus on the personages or "Partzufim" as opposed to the Sephiroth. The World of Rectification or "Tiqqune Olahm" consists of these Partzufim which are the rectified Sephiroth that had shattered in the "Death of the Edomite Kings" (this is the "Breaking of the Vessels" or "Shevirah H'Kelim"... a Lurianic "received" doctrine). The tradition of Luria and the Lurianic Tree differs from the GRA tree (the Gaon of Vilna, is referred to as the GRA, or ha-GRA, an acronym for ha-Gaon Rabbi Eliyahu). In actuality, in the Lurianic Tree(s) the Paths are not fixed in stone. The Paths are formed and re-formed by the interactions that occur between the various Personages. This provides more flexibility than often presumed. The Paths do not exist until the Partzufim (Countenances/Personages) turn towards each other Face to Face. The Lurianic system is based on a Mythopoetic Interpretation of these various interactions. The previous Sephiroth shattered becuase they lacked the means to interact with each other. They could only receive the Infinite Light, and were unable to impart it. Since the nature of the Divine Light is Infinite the Sephiroth received until they shattered.
When the residua of the Fallen and Shattered Kings/Vessels were resurrected, they were reorganized into three Columns in the likeness of the Supernal Sephiroth, which did not shatter under the immensity of the light… they were also resurrected into the Partzufim/Countenances/Personages in order to give and receive the Light (forming a method of gradually reducing the Light… and a type of “bleeder valve” such as on the brakes of a motor vehicle).
The most important interactions between the Partzufim are of a Sexual Nature… made possible by the ability of certain Sephiroth of the Central Column to be able to ascend and descend the Tree. In particular, Yesod, Tiphareth, and Da’ath. Yesod (the sexual member) has to move up and down to stimulate “Zivugim” or Conjunctions between various Personages. Tiphareth provides a vessel to Da’ath; as Da’ath is the “Inner Light” of the Partzuf, Zaur Anpin… and thus lacks a "Vessel".
There is a reason both Da’ath and Tiphareth are attributed to the letter “Vav” which is the “Nail”… as this Central Line (the “Vav”) connects/conjoins things together. Think of when someone speaks crudely of sexual activity as “nailing” someone, per se.
The Hermetic Order of the G.’.D.’. incorporated many diagrams and Kabbalistic information from the Two Enormous Volumes of the “Cabala Denudata” of Christian Knorr von Rosenroth, which was primarily a collection of Lurianic Texts. Mathers only translated 3 short chapters of the Zohar (which are the Three primary chapters focused on by the Holy Lion, the G_dly One - Ashkenazi Rabbi Itzaak; the reincarnation of Simeon ben Yohai) in his translation of this/these tome(s). Thus they utilized syncretic methods in incorporating the names… which have hidden meanings… quite unknown in most Hermetic groups. Suffice it to say that if one really explores the texts in conjunction with the Zohar… these Names conceal many Mysteries most worthy of their study. Crowley included in 777 some of this material… which is necessary to perform certain Mystical Acts of Unification termed “Lurianic Yehudim”.
Think of letters without the thought to organize them into words. Only when "illumined" by the Light of the Intellect do they form words that can convey the Thought of the Creator of the Letters/Formulator of the Words, to another being. However, the being that receives the letters interprets them through her/his intellect before "Understanding" them. The letters, , the vessels, the attributes/emanations/Sephiroth, and the Personages form a whole so to speak. In their collective Unity they are meaningful, but lacking any part thereof... they are simply a jumble of non-sensical consonants that cannot communicate the "Divine Light". Meditation on the collective unity can "Impart" meaning and "Reveal" the things that are "Concealed" within.
Just my take on things. Hopefully, this doesn't confuse things more for you.
Love is the Law, Love under Will.
Warm Regards,
Dennis -
Dennis,
That was excellent. I thank you.
Clear summation and presented in steps.
Thanks,
Chris H. -
93,
"The Lurianic system is a focus on the personages or "Partzufim" as opposed to the Sephiroth. "
Could you clarify these Partzufim further? I'm not clear whether you see them as being akin to Archangels, or to the Atziluthic aspects of Divinity ... or something else.
93 93/93,
EM
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Yes, I'm interested as well.
Also, you say:
"In Zoharic or Lurianic Kabbalah the Partzufim take precedence over the Sephiroth."
To my mind, this is merely the difference between looking at the same concept either from ...what would you call it... a mathmatico-rational perspective or a mythopoetical perspective. To say that the Partzufim take precedence over the Sephiroth... Would you consider that a practical distinction more for the purpose of helping the mind more ably relate to these concepts than an a actual distinction? Or is there something more to the difference in language than that?
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Hello,
Good questions but my emphasis was in showing how Da'ath is included in the Divine Name for Tiphareth... as relating to their purpose within the same Partzuf, and encouraging meditation and study on the topic. Also, offering an alternative point of view.
However, I will provide some further information:
"It is important that one realize that the Letters and the Sephiroth are really One and the Same Thing. However, due to the fact that no Light spreads without a Vessel, when both are spoken of together (when the Light is clothed by a Vessel) they are termed “Sephiroth“ , but when the Vessels alone are spoken of they are then termed Letters (Otiot)."
"The Vessel has a different form than the Light and this is quite obvious upon examination. The Will to Receive is an entirely different Form because it is in no manner found within the Emanator. From Whom would he receive from?"
"The presence of Characters (Letters) points to either the presence of a Vessel or to the Source of One."
The Sephiroth are only able to shine when they have the ability to "Share" or "Give". The Sephiroth were organized into Partzufim as without this reorganization they were unable to "Give" but only were able to "Receive".
The letters are empty Vessels.
When these "Vessels" contain Light, they are termed "Sephiroth".
However, to emulate the "Creator" they have to do more than just "Receive". They must also "Give".
The Sephiroth can not "Give" until "Re-organized" into "Partzufim" and thereby emulate the "Creator".
"Giving" is referred to as "Shining".
The "Kabbalah" is about "Receiving" and "Giving"... Light.
There is more of a distinction here than Semantics, yet there is a Unity between Letters, Sephiroth, Partzufim but to "Understand" this, requires study and meditation.
However, the Partzufim are not the same as the Sephiroth. For example... Zaur Anpin has only 6 Sephiroth and is not complete without a full compliment of 10 Sephiroth... he receives one by conjoining with the Female, and three through the development of the "Mochin" (Mental Powers/Brains) as he "Matures".
Note how small children have difficulty "Sharing" but are able to freely "Give" as they "Mature.
"A Partzuf is only considered complete when all Ten of its Individual Sephiroth Shine."
Hope this helps but my explanations are no substitute for meditation and study... and again my response was meant to show a correlation between the word Da'ath being a component of the Divine Name of Tiphareth. The relationship between the use of Names as given in Gikatilla's "Portae Lucis" along with study of "The Book of Concealed Mystery" and the Greater and Lesser Holy Assemblies" of the Zohar; along with "Chayim Vital's "The Tree of Life" would be good sources of validating my statements.
Warm Regards,
Dennis (sometimes called Olen) -
"Hope this helps but my explanations are no substitute for meditation and study... and again my response was meant to show a correlation between the word Da'ath being a component of the Divine Name of Tiphareth. The relationship between the use of Names as given in Gikatilla's "Portae Lucis" along with study of "The Book of Concealed Mystery" and the Greater and Lesser Holy Assemblies" of the Zohar; along with "Chayim Vital's "The Tree of Life" would be good sources of validating my statements.
"Thank you for all your information. It has the feel of some concepts that have been highlighting themselves in my creative intuition, but I haven't known where or how to study/confirm them, or even how to ask where to look.
Thank you once again.
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Metzareph:
I would recommend you to check out what Kenneth Grant and Thomas Karlsson has written on the subject. Especially the books "Hecates Fountain" and "Qabalah, Qliphoth and Goetic Magic".The issue of Tiphareth, Daath and Thagirion have many many layers.