Body of Light exercises
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@Jim Eshelman said
"Primarily, OBE has nothing to do with the others, and actually is never required in the standardized course of training. It's a nice side-effect, and has virtue, but it's not part of what's required. What appears to be an OBE-type experience (creating an artificial body and transferring your consciousness to it) is a training method for opening and focusing your inner senses to become perceptive and functional in Yetzirah. "
Hi Jim,
Thanks for the thoughtful response. I'm curious whether OBEs "feel" different than Body of Light travel. For example, is there an overlap (could an OBE turn into astral travel and vice-versa)? Are OBE's more "real" subjectively?
What I'm worried about is expecting the wrong sort of experience. I've read many accounts that astral projection is essentially like "real life" but I also read about people doing "pathworkings" or whatever and they're basically in a chair having visual images pop-up like a daydream, but it's not fully immersive in the same sense.
I realize I've probably convoluted some terms, but I'd appreciate any insight nonetheless.
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@Jim Eshelman said
"Some further thought on the above:
Within the magical traditions, especially of Western initiating orders, intentionally engendered and directed vision work is an important part of the training. It is perhaps the most important part of the training and practice that accomplishes the specific task of opens one from the World of Assiah to the World of Yetzirah. It shows up under various names, such as viewing, scrying, or travelling in the astral, in the fine body, or in the spirit vision.
Astral travelling is probably the most misleading term, because it wrongly infers that one is going from one place to another. In terms of physical space, this is not so; however, inwardly, psychologically, even spiritually, one is most certainly undertaking a pilgrimage. The term scrying has more advantages, because it means an active, intentional seeking of something.
This scrying is an induced waking dream. The part of the mind through which one enters such a vision is one’s personal sub-consciousness, the field of mind wherein dreams occur. Just as with dreams, the distinctive language of these visions, often peculiar and haunting to the rational self-conscious mind, has symbols for its “words.” Symbols are the units of the distinctive language of subconsciousness.
This doesn't mean that the method is "just imagination" in the minimizing sense that phrase is usually used. Your imagination is your power of visualization on the plane of Yetzirah, and, when backed by conscious intention, is the psychological tool that actively creates (short-term or long-term) actualities in the substance of Yetzirah, just as a potter uses physical hands to mold a specific shape from physical clay. Your power of "imagination" - that is, imaging - is your faculty of sight (vision) in Yetzirah. Your personal subconscious mind is the portal through which you enter this world (since it is a somewhat segregated pool of Yetzirah itself, just as your physical body is a somewhat segregated 'pool' of physical substance existing within the larger physical world)."
Just wanted to say:
This is one of the most helpful collections of information and explanation I have ever received from you, Jim.
You're super duper.[Yes, I just called you super duper. I'm tired.]
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@Escarabaj said
"I'm curious whether OBEs "feel" different than Body of Light travel. For example, is there an overlap (could an OBE turn into astral travel and vice-versa)? Are OBE's more "real" subjectively?"
There's certainly a relationship. It's not that hard to explain the difference.'
What are commonly called Out of Body Experiences are technically etheric projections. The etheric level is sometimes called "lower astral." It's closer to the physical, though - Qabalistically attributed to to Malkuth rather than Yesod, for example (or, perhaps more accurately, part of Assiah instead of Yetzirah). The "etheric world" is the subtle level immediately under the physical universe, the one you read about in various occult works as being the 'astral' framework that holds matter in place.
From an experiential point of view, when exteriorizing from your body at the etheric level (i.e., when operating your senses from an etheric or dense-astral, 'body,' you pass through what looks very much like the physical world around you. The etheric forms are essentially the same as the physical universe. The two are causatively related.
In contrast, the 'astral world' proper needn't look anything at all like the physical world around you. It might do so incidentally, as in a dream; or it might do so initially, as a take-off point; but, in this case, it is doing so as a symbolic representation, or as a convenience for orientation etc.
"What I'm worried about is expecting the wrong sort of experience."
Yes, expectations can screw with you
. Instead, why not set them aside and simply record what you actually get.You're apparently trying to go this alone. I know that's a popular idea, and it's "in" to be all in favor of independent undertaking. I'm just not sold on it. I still think the first thing someone should do when entering this work is find a teacher and latch on for the duration. The Great Work is undertaken partly by personal effort (and the great breakthroughs are, ultimately, entirely of that sort); but the linkage and empowerment come from direct person-to-person transmission, generation after generation. I don't think you can find a single great initiator in history who "did it all by himself." They all got the key catalyst from a teacher (one might better say, a trainer).
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@Jim Eshelman said
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@Escarabaj said
"I'm curious whether OBEs "feel" different than Body of Light travel. For example, is there an overlap (could an OBE turn into astral travel and vice-versa)? Are OBE's more "real" subjectively?"There's certainly a relationship. It's not that hard to explain the difference.'
What are commonly called Out of Body Experiences are technically etheric projections. The etheric level is sometimes called "lower astral." It's closer to the physical, though - Qabalistically attributed to to Malkuth rather than Yesod, for example (or, perhaps more accurately, part of Assiah instead of Yetzirah). The "etheric world" is the subtle level immediately under the physical universe, the one you read about in various occult works as being the 'astral' framework that holds matter in place.
From an experiential point of view, when exteriorizing from your body at the etheric level (i.e., when operating your senses from an etheric or dense-astral, 'body,' you pass through what looks very much like the physical world around you. The etheric forms are essentially the same as the physical universe. The two are causatively related.
In contrast, the 'astral world' proper needn't look anything at all like the physical world around you. It might do so incidentally, as in a dream; or it might do so initially, as a take-off point; but, in this case, it is doing so as a symbolic representation, or as a convenience for orientation etc. "
In that case, is the Body of Light astral or etheric, what plane does it operate on?
I'm assuming it's the astral because the world explored in the BOL, and the BOL itself do not need to resemble the physical universe. That's interesting as that would imply it is more difficult to achieve etheric projection. But when does etheric projection actually occur? As far as I can tell, only NDE accounts seem to mirror a duplicate universe resembling the physical one without deviation...even those tend to deviate to a non physical light or something of a less objective nature. Interesting distinction you point out between OBE and dreaming- I had not seen it that way before.
Could it be said that BOL and 'astral' exploration in locations resembling the physical universe are partaking of the etheric plane? My point being that the BOL and it's activities start on the etheric level and then enter the astral plane. -
@Mahanta70 said
"In that case, is the Body of Light astral or etheric, what plane does it operate on?"
It depends on how you build it, and how far out you get. It may only be "a figment of your imagination." It may be etheric (Assiah). Or it may be astral-proper (Yetzirah).
"But when does etheric projection actually occur? As far as I can tell, only NDE accounts seem to mirror a duplicate universe resembling the physical one without deviation...even those tend to deviate to a non physical light or something of a less objective nature."
One can train for it. There are particular techniques where it's useful. Most systems that train it at all don't bother until pretty late in the training program.
"Could it be said that BOL and 'astral' exploration in locations resembling the physical universe are partaking of the etheric plane?"
Not necessarily. You can use a "mock-up" of a known physical place for, say, a dream context (or any other vision).
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A simple explanation of Alrah's exercise can be found in Mumfords book of Magical Tattwa Cards. Unfortunately it is out of print, but worth the money to get your hands on it.
BTW I am loving everyone's contributions on this thread!
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Speaking of the etheric vs astral....
I don't know if this is a common mistake, or just because I have a preponderance of earth signs in my chart... but...
Confusing the two was my first big mistake. I kept trying to physically leave my body at first. I succeeded in separating from the waist up, but it was all very tedious and strange...
Then I figured out what I was doing wrong. I was trying to go "out" when I really was supposed to be going "in".
Here's a quick sketch of a pretty common model for the collective unconscious...
http://soothandlies.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/Universe.jpg
The blue is the material world
The humps are individuals
The lightest grey is the personal conscious
The medium grey is the personal unconscious
The darkest grey is the collective unconsciousWith astral travel, you can independently verify your data... in other words, you crossed the line separating your personal unconscious, and entered the collective unconscious. The tricky part, to me, is maintaining consciousness and intent, while "turning off" the input from 1) the material world, then 2) the personal conscious, then 3) the personal unconscious. It's like walking a tightrope. It's easy for me to either lose consciousness and/or fall asleep, or get pulled out of the astral by physical or mental stimuli.
I strongly suspect dharana exercises help you deal with the physical/mental distractions, so that you can maintain greater consciousness and travel deeper.
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@Faus said
"There is a variation of the Body of Light technique in Denning & Phillip book on astral projection. It is focused in the specific irradiation of what they call “nephesh substance” as a way to build the BoL.
I do not know in what extend it is different of the one present in Liber O ( or if it can be used to attain the same objective)."
It's essentially the same thing. They have tweaked methodology a bit.
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Thought I'd ask : anyone try exercises in books by Robert Bruce? He's an Australian guy who has -from what I can tell- a pretty reputable career working with astral projection and so forth. He has a book on energy work and so forth. A lot of it has to do with energy circulation, but I've not worked through it or anything. Seems very good though.
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for users that have fear of "getting lost"
i use a point of reference, basically i believe there is a beacon in my mind, normally something i favor or like, glowing things or things that have light to them work best i have found.
the best way i have found to practice is ..... find a friend online..ask to call them on the phone...electronics help...someone that wantz to experment... basically concentrait on them and thier surroundings, wait...and find peace...see through thier eyes...through thier mind... thier memory of where they are....after you have "absorbed" all the sights and sounds around you...some of the images may be blurred..but describe it back to them...intill the picture becomes clear...good practice atleast.
i was one of the people that struggled with the fear of "getting lost"...mainly cause when i was a child i would OOB and felt very scared and not knowing how to get back in or that i would float off to "no where"
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I read some books when I was younger about astral travel and creating a body from a silver cord that comes out of your naval. I got very good at it and astral traveled all over the city in areas that were close to me.
I quite after I had what I felt was an astral attack. I had a dream that turned into astral travel when a friend in my dream asked me to follow him all over the world. I did just that. I followed him to many beautiful places. He finally stopped and said “this is it” I just looked at him and said “What do you mean?” He looked me strait in my eyes and said “you are now lost and you can’t find your way home.” Then he laughed. I woke up instantly in my dark bed room and lost direction in my own bedroom for about a minute or two. I have been afraid of the dark since then and have not done astral travel.
It was not till a couple of years ago that I realized that I had learned the most important lesson of all… You can’t get lost while astral traveling. No matter where you go you are always attached to your body with the silver cord.
This has not removed the fear of the dark though.
I think that will be the first thing I work on as I study.
BOL's will have to wait till I am good in other things such as the new rituals I am learning.
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@Blythe A. Blanche said
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@Mahanta70 said
"I visualize the BOL before me and then I move it's limbs and try twisting around."Ignoring the rest of this thread for now, the twisting around technique you mention almost immediately guided my visualization of shifting my consciousness to the Body of Light when I attempted it a few moments ago. It's amazing how something that wasn't even the core of your post could get me further in potential Astral work than a year of solo practice has done. Thank you for this."
A different take:
With your Mercury in detriment (or Fall, I forget) in Pisces, and square to Uranus and Neptune conjunct in Sagittarius, your biggest issue is going to be Mind: separation of the real and the mundane, and attempting to over think what is really a simple process. Your Saturn (in it's natural sign) comes to the aid of your Mercury with a sextile, giving you the Will to overcome the aforementioned obstacles. The Moon is really the key in this matter. She lies on the Aries-Taurus cusp, Taurus being her exaltation. She is sextile to Mars in Pisces (a postion we both share). Luna being the planet of the sensorium, and Mars, representative of energy, being in a most psychic sign, you have only to augment those parts of your character pertinent to your aims. This is Magick. Rituals to the affect of bringing clarity to your Mercurial aspects, and rituals to strengthen that Luna-Mars bond will help you to discipline your psyche to the point of perfect control.
Once the psyche is conquered, and the mind stilled (practices to be mastered prior to any attempted "Astral Projection,"--once these things are mastered, the matter is simply one of finding the gap between dream and consciousness, which is the door through you must enter. This is no easy task, as one has to enter the REM state while retaining complete consciousness. An easy thing done with certain drugs, but this method lacks the necessary discipline required to control the Astral process. It isn't any fun to enter a strange territory without knowing how to navigate it--like setting sail without the necessary charts and equipment, or even a crew.
In order to enter the Astral realm, you need to examine your precise strengths and weaknesses, and know yourself well enough to make the transition between planes. This is why I advocate Astrology when problems are found with individual Astral techniques: most struggle with the practice, but few take advantage of the best resource they have: a map on one's personal Microcosm, and its relation to the Macrocosm.
You show great ability, Blythe. I'd advise you, in light of your talents, to study your natal chart. It will help your advancement a great deal.
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@fnewburn4236 said
"This has not removed the fear of the dark though.
"fear of the dark, is it the darkness you fear? or what iz hidden in the dark? iz it the unknown?
what u encountered, and i am sure u realize thiz, waz not ur friend at all, tiz a familiar spirit.
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@Qemuel said
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@fnewburn4236 said
"This has not removed the fear of the dark though. "fear of the dark, is it the darkness you fear? or what iz hidden in the dark? iz it the unknown?
what u encountered, and i am sure u realize thiz, waz not ur friend at all, tiz a familiar spirit."
I am not afraid to be in the dark. I am afraid to sleep in the dark... Yes I know, it sounds wierd, but it was triggered way back then. or maybe I am unwilling to admit I am scared of the dark
when I truly feel that I am not scared.So you say it may have been my familiar or someone elses. I did not know I had a familiar
but anything may be possible. -
@fnewburn4236 said
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I am not afraid to be in the dark. I am afraid to sleep in the dark... Yes I know, it sounds wierd, but it was triggered way back then. or maybe I am unwilling to admit I am scared of the dark
when I truly feel that I am not scared.So you say it may have been my familiar or someone elses. I did not know I had a familiar
but anything may be possible. "i would do a test, meditate in pitch black(as dark as you can make it), just relax and meditate, either u will end up feeling fear or peace, if its fear you feel than you know its not sleeping in the dark that you are scared of.
i mean it was a familiar, i do not know if it was yours or sum1 elses. A familiar spirit will often "appear" as though it is something familiar too you.
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Not sure if this has been dealt with elsewhere on this forum, but I have found the use of incense to be helpful. The tables of correspondences for perfumes in 777 can be treated as something of a cookbook in this regard. It's also a great way to learn this column of correspondences! There are two columns, one having to do with the traditional Yetziratic attributions of the 32 paths, and the other having to do with the four elements and the their sub-elements (earth of water, air of water, etc). I found this second list of elemental attributions much more intuitive and satisfying to work with than the former.
There were times when, apart from any other prep I might have made for an excursion, the perfume acted as a powerful invocation in its own right. Though, invocation is probably not the correct word. Maybe it's enough for me to say that the images had greater depth and the vision overall seemed to unfold for me more dramatically from what I was used to without this aid.
Of course, you can easily spend several hundred dollars acquiring a complete set of samples. I personally wasted a fair bit of money because I had to experiment with various forms of some substances to figure out which produced the cleanest scent, as well as how best to activate them. Cedar and Myrtle, for example, can readily be purchased as wood or leaf, but they don't burn well, smelling more like burning wood or leaves than anything specific. It took research to clue me into the fact that both are sold as essential oils and that an aroma-lamp was the best way to activate their scent. My biggest expense was purchasing a stainless steel plate that I suspend over the flame of an alcohol lamp. This allows me to heat some of the more liquid resins like Galbanum or Siamese Benzoin without the necessity of producing a lot of nasty smoke. Indigo, on the other hand, is meant to be smokey, and so a decent incense burner that is designed to handle live charcoal does the trick; this is also required for the harder resins like Mrrrh, Sumatra Benzoin, and Opoponax. Camphor is just left out on a plate and allowed to evaporate on its own.
I don't know, maybe you already do something along these lines, but if not, maybe its worth an experiment or three!
Peace and 93
Robert