Babalon 2.0
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@Dar said
"
"But she wears many veils... innumerable veils... and varieties of projection probably make up most of them."Is a projection - a lie?
"Not necessarily. One of the basic instructions we give initiates working through their projection drills deals with the false assessment, "That's not a projection, it's true! She really is a bitch!" (etc.) Projections are easier when there is a matching or similar external object onto which we can project.
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@Dar said
"Projections always seem to be matched up with behaviours associated with the defense mechanisms. "
Classic psychiatric projection is classified as a defense mechanism, yes. More broadly (and usefully), though, it's simply the perceiving, in something external to yourself, some aspect of yourself of which you are presently unconscious.
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@Dar said
"
He said "Samsara means the endless cycle of deluded existence!"
And she exclaimed "How wonderful!"
"This punchline actually describes a big part of what I've been feeling. Yes, that's it exactly, and why Babablon seems so subversive and freaking out of control!
It's the suspicion that the car that slammed into my little hybrid an hour before I had planned to drive up to Venice for the Study Group meeting last Thursday was Babalon. And the two people who were in the car that slammed into my car, and who were two people seriously in the grip of the despair and disatisfaction that clearly was their lives and would be the key-notes of the whole rest of their lives, this too was Babalon.
And I could perhaps experiment and see any of these things in my world as her, and this would be a sort of worship; but also a sense that if I didn't, if I just allowed myself to curse the creator for his inequality, I still would be paying homage to her, I still would be reaching out to embrace her.
Love and Will
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@RobertAllen said
"This punchline actually describes a big part of what I've been feeling. Yes, that's it exactly, and why Babablon seems so subversive and freaking out of control! "
She's certainly not "under control," in the same way that feelings aren't "under control." (This is also the subtheme, wherein She is that that aspect of woman that isn't under male dominion.)
Binah reflecfts into Netzach, as Chokmah reflects into Hod. Horizontally, 'control' is the intellectual function in Hod, not the vital, feeling aspect of Netzach. Vertically, Binah is supernal, and therefore transrational. In this sense she is Mystery itself, that which can never quite be pinned down. (But this isn't her exclusively - Chokmah is as much Mystery.)
I'm wondering, in fact, if your real struggle here isn't with Babalon per se (though her name is as good a name as any other) - but, more particularly, to THAT in you which is the ever-receeding goal - the ideal that grows faster than capacity - the one that "goes ever before you, even when you saw it not." I'm not being vague - I'm just not giving a single name to something that is especially characterized by not being pinnable.
But if I gave it a name, it would be the Holy Guardian Angel.
"It's the suspicion that the car that slammed into my little hybrid an hour before I had planned to drive up to Venice for the Study Group meeting last Thursday was Babalon. And the two people who were in the car that slammed into my car, and who were two people seriously in the grip of the despair and disatisfaction that clearly was their lives and would be the key-notes of the whole rest of their lives, this too was Babalon. "
All surely so.
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@Jim Eshelman said
"I'm wondering, in fact, if your real struggle here isn't with Babalon per se (though her name is as good a name as any other)"
@Jim Eshelman said
"But if I gave it a name, it would be the Holy Guardian Angel."
I know there is confusion here. And I did not want to look at the confusion too closely, at least not just yet. But since the question has been asked.
Initially, when I felt the attraction, I had some guilt. And I asked myself, though without expecting much of an answer: what is the relationship between my newly found feeling for Babalon and the HGA? The best I could do was to admit to myself that the feelings were genuine, and that fact had to count for something—my mistakes are honest mistakes. So I thought, best just wait on that score and see how things play out.
I'm uncertain if the feeling for Babalon just became a convenient vehicle—real as a result of encountering her mythology and representation in the Aethyrs; so that, despite the full-screen presentation of the Babalon concept, what I really mean, when I say I love her, is that I love Adonai.
Or, maybe I'm in fact sleeping around, and Babalon seems more real to me now because she is more real to me.
Or maybe there is some connection between the two, and the knot of confusion is more elaborate than I would have guessed. This last possibility is the one I would choose if it were up to me.
Love and Will
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I met my husband when I was 29 years old. He grew up in very small country village, with a very small family and circle of friends. I grew up, with a huge extened family, "foster" kids on the outskirts of a very large city.
My life up to that point of meeting, was varied, rich, full, extensive, some would say.....other would say, wild, rebellious, party like.
I have alot of stories, memories, expierences and stuff. information, details, That is what I have to share.
and he wants to know, he wants to understand, to see why I am like and am, he likes to lift back my veils so to speak, and uncover me.
Mr. Eshelman said, MILF and I LOL, hit the nail right onthe head.
I dont mind sharing somethings, letting some veils go,
giving, sharing myselfBut I dont think it is healthy to rip away to many veils at once, I think that is not good. It wont hurt me if he knows, and understands. Understanding comes through layers, a building upon. If I reveal too much to soon, well....
wink wink, nudge nudge....know what I mean?
Does your wife, ya know...
GO?wink wink nudge nudge......
that is one of my favorite lines.
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Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law.
"Binah reflecfts into Netzach, as Chokmah reflects into Hod. Horizontally, 'control' is the intellectual function in Hod, not the vital, feeling aspect of Netzach."
Which also corresponds nicely to Chap. VII and VIII of MTP Part II, also being representative of Netzach (VII) and Hod (VIII) respectively. IMHO this is why elucidation of the Cup and the Sword are very necessary to Understanding, which is in Binah/Babalon.
"I'm wondering, in fact, if your real struggle here isn't with Babalon per se (though her name is as good a name as any other) - but, more particularly, to THAT in you which is the ever-receeding goal - the ideal that grows faster than capacity - the one that "goes ever before you, even when you saw it not." I'm not being vague - I'm just not giving a single name to something that is especially characterized by not being pinnable."
This reminds me of my reading today...
In most extant magical rituals the two operations are performed at once; or (at least) the banishing has the more important place, and greater pains seem to be taken with it; but as the student advances to Adeptship the banishing will diminish in importance, for it will no longer be so necessary. The Circle of the Magician will have been perfected by his habit of Magical work. In the truest sense of that word, he will never step outside the Circle during his whole life. But the consecration, being the application of a positive force, can always be raised to a closer approximation to perfection. Complete success in banishing is soon attained; but there can be no completeness in the advance to holiness.
-- MTP Part III, Chap XIV
Also:
"And, of course, one of her most effective "uses" is her MILF-hood."
That is hilarious! So true!!! I never heard it put quite so eloquently Jim!!! Love is the law, love under will.
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@Jim Eshelman said
"Not necessarily. One of the basic instructions we give initiates working through their projection drills deals with the false assessment, "That's not a projection, it's true! She really is a bitch!" (etc.) Projections are easier when there is a matching or similar external object onto which we can project."
"projection drills"...?
Do you mind sharing, or are those protected?
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@Aegis55 said
""projection drills"...?
Do you mind sharing, or are those protected?"
I'll give the basics, but not the details. All members of Temple of Thelema, beginning at a particular degree (and focussed especially in two particular degrees) are required to observe, record in their diary, and analyze all occassions of psychological projection they detect in themselves. Step one is to catch when you're looking in a mirror; step 2 is actually looking in that mirror, observing what you see, and doing certain work with it.
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"I'll give the basics, but not the details. All members of Temple of Thelema, beginning at a particular degree (and focussed especially in two particular degrees) are required to observe, record in their diary, and analyze all occassions of psychological projection they detect in themselves. Step one is to catch when you're looking in a mirror; step 2 is actually looking in that mirror, observing what you see, and doing certain work with it."
Thanks. It will be a little longer before I am ready to apply anywhere, but I need this kind of stuff right now regardless.
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a golden thread!
what an enjoyable read! the breaks... over. thanks!
93!
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Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law.
I would like to ask something, if I could of course. In Visions & Voices, page 58 and talking about Weakness in Crowley's approach, it is written following:
"In the Second Order of the Golden Dawn, these tablets were created so that each square was a truncated pyramid, and Babalon is called "Queen of the City of Pyramids" - which is as much the forest of pyramids on these elemental tablets as anything else."
It is very usual opinion that Crowley "invented" Babalon. Is quote above means that Babalon was used in Golden Dawn as deity before Crowley?
Love is the law, love under will.
B.
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@HPK said
"It is very usual opinion that Crowley "invented" Babalon. Is quote above means that Babalon was used in Golden Dawn as deity before Crowley? "
She wasn't acknowledge anywhere in the GD system. The quote means that her Name comes to 156, and the number of squares on each of the Elemental Tablets is 156, and so there's a link.
Babalon, spelled this way, appears no place at all in the whole of the world's literature before The Vision & the Voice. However, it is broadly accepted that at least some of historic references to Babylon were slightly corrupt or mistaken references to her - e.g., "the whore of Babylon" in Revelations was perhaps meant to be "the whore Babalon."
There is also an Enochian word babalond, meaning "harlot," that is likely the etymological origin of her name.
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Just following up on my initial post.
Since starting thread I have been pondering and ruminating about how best to conceive and understand this concept.
She is illusive. No sooner than it seems I have another piece of the puzzle she seems to move on, and my attempt to spell out what I thought I understood seems dead and definitely not Babalon.
My mind has such an overwhelming tendency to try and reduce all things to that which is useful, and that which isn't. And it seems this effort is making it impossible to understand.
It seems the best I can do in this instance is just stop trying.
Love and Will
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You may want to consider removing the seperation between yourself and Babalon.
Also, consider where "meaning" is, Babalon isn't.
Lastly, you may also want to consider there is no such thing in life called Babalon.
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@Shadonis said
"You may want to consider removing the seperation between yourself and Babalon."
if you remove the separation, what's the fun?
"For I am divided for love's sake, for the chance of union" -
"if you remove the separation, what's the fun?"
The joy of dissolution
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"All saints revile her, and all sober men
Ruled by the God Apollo's golden mean—
In scorn of which I sailed to find her
In distant regions likeliest to hold her
Whom I desired above all things to know,
Sister of the mirage and echo."—Robert Graves, from the dedication to his book The White Goddess
Love and Will
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Thanks for that, Robert.
Today, I have been struggling with sense vs. non-sense. In that light, Babalon can seem just as abhorrent as Choronzon.
But that's the wrong light.
And that was a scandalous thought to me until I read that poem.
Duh. Of course."Some dance to remember.
Some dance to forget."Thanks.
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I just found this quote, I thought it was amusing, and fairly on target:
"The Harlot Babylon is preparing the nations to receive the antichrist. The Harlot Babylon will be a religion of affirmation, toleration, no absolutes, a counterfeit justice movement. They will feed the poor, have humanitarian projects, inspire acts of compassion for all the wrong reasons. They won't know it ... I believe that one of the main pastors as a forerunner to the Harlot movement is Oprah." ~ Mike Bickle, New Apostolic Reformation (NAR)
America's own Taliban
A fast growing right-wing politico-religious presence plans to implement an end-times, Christian theocracy in the US.
english.aljazeera.net/indepth/opinion/2011/07/20117259426336524.html