Questions on Liber Resh
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I have a brief question about Liber Resh..
It was explained, in another topic, the symbolic location of
the practitioner is placed between Yesod and Tipharet.My question is, why would one use the LVX signs towards Tipharet?
Isn't this an "Old Aeon" perspective? Aren't the LVX signs, according
to the "New Aeon", referring to Malkuth? -
@TOHPA said
"My question is, why would one use the LVX signs towards Tipharet? Isn't this an "Old Aeon" perspective? Aren't the LVX signs, according to the "New Aeon", referring to Malkuth?"
In A.'.A.'., they remain the grade signs of 5=6, the Tiphereth grade. See the frontispiece of Magick in Theory & Practice for the grade signs up to Tiphereth.
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Although I remember the illustrations of the LVX signs in Magick in Theory & Practice, I can't recall it mentioning a direct correspondence with 5=6. I can't check it out right now though, but I trust your words.
This issue has troubled me quite a bit, lately. Various Thelemic literature suggest that the LVX signs and the IAO formula are applied only in Malkuth, since the concept of resurrection has been replaced with the Enthronemend of RHK in Tiphareth. So, if I may inquire, what is the role of the LVX formula in Tiphareth from a Thelemic point of view? How can it practically be applied and what's its role in the K&C with the HGA?
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For starters... don't confuse the LVX signs with the Osiris legend. That's the part that is old aeon.
Second, LVX is the entire formula of initiation up to (and through) Tiphereth. It is the essence of adepthood. Even 6=5 and 7=4 are grades of LVX. However, the aspiration of those latter grades is toward the Abyss, so we start to see the NOX formulae interwoven. LVX is the formula of attainment in Tiphereth, and NOX the formula of attainment in Binah.
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@Froclown said
"Now say what you will on the notion of a vital force, but as a ritual symbolic idea it's very effective, and it seems the sexual fluids, like that of embryionic fluids in eggs and in plant seeds do contain concentration of nutrients and chemical transmitters, some not commonly found in the diet."
Abstinate from ejaculation so that in time you won't produce semen, that way you'll preserve those nutrients.
(I'm not suggesting for anyone to really do that, of course)
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I'd like to discuss Liber Resh from a different point of view. Maybe the Godforms honored aren't the central issue; maybe Resh is actually a tool for helping you to establish a different point of view. I'll explain what I mean. Crowley obviously felt Resh was very important, he made it the fundamental ritual for aspirants to the A.:A.: for example, but the question remains: what is the goal of it? I believe the answer to that question was given by Fr. Achad in an essay titled: "Stepping out of the old aeon and into the new", which Crowley published in The Equinox Vol III, No I. In it Achad suggests that the conception of a dying and resurrected God, which was the central idea of the religion of the old aeon was based on the daily "birth" and "death" of the sun. Since we now understand that the movement of the Earth creates the appearance of the movement of the Sun, we realize that the Sun is always shining on the Earth, at midnight, sunrise, noon, and sunset. If you put this idea clearly in mind, you shift your perspective from the cyclic nature of planetary existence to become a solar being- From Samsara to Moksha, liberation from the cycle of re-birth. Perhaps Resh was designed as a first step toward solar consciousness.
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@siriusly23 said
"I'd like to discuss Liber Resh from a different point of view. Maybe the Godforms honored aren't the central issue; maybe Resh is actually a tool for helping you to establish a different point of view. I'll explain what I mean. Crowley obviously felt Resh was very important, he made it the fundamental ritual for aspirants to the A.:A.: for example, but the question remains: what is the goal of it? I believe the answer to that question was given by Fr. Achad in an essay titled: "Stepping out of the old aeon and into the new", which Crowley published in The Equinox Vol III, No I. In it Achad suggests that the conception of a dying and resurrected God, which was the central idea of the religion of the old aeon was based on the daily "birth" and "death" of the sun. Since we now understand that the movement of the Earth creates the appearance of the movement of the Sun, we realize that the Sun is always shining on the Earth, at midnight, sunrise, noon, and sunset. If you put this idea clearly in mind, you shift your perspective from the cyclic nature of planetary existence to become a solar being- From Samsara to Moksha, liberation from the cycle of re-birth. Perhaps Resh was designed as a first step toward solar consciousness."
How shall I say this to be oh so gentle as possible. ...... uhm..... yeah.
ps. good catch!
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I came at it from a different approach.
Those four different imagined perspectives are valuable organizers to one's psychic day.
People hear me talk about some of my crazy and about "plotlines" that originate in the unconscious and can be projected on people and events throughout the day. I struggled much more with such things before I internalized the thought that I was constantly hearing at least 4 different opinions about how the plotline was progressing - that the whole truth was bigger than any one of the four perspectives - that it takes an entire day to hear the whole truth.
Now it's time for the Ra in thy rising perspective.
Now it's time for the Ahathoor in thy triumphing perspective.
Etc..It really helped order my experience and reduce a lot of the wackadoo.
I believe it is nothing if not completely functional.
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@Aegis said
"I came at it from a different approach.
Those four different imagined perspectives are valuable organizers to one's psychic day.
People hear me talk about some of my crazy and about "plotlines" that originate in the unconscious and can be projected on people and events throughout the day. I struggled much more with such things before I internalized the thought that I was constantly hearing at least 4 different opinions about how the plotline was progressing - that the whole truth was bigger than any one of the four perspectives - that it takes an entire day to hear the whole truth.
Now it's time for the Ra in thy rising perspective.
Now it's time for the Ahathoor in thy triumphing perspective.
Etc..It really helped order my experience and reduce a lot of the wackadoo.
I believe it is nothing if not completely functional."
Not that there's anything to disagree with up there... but to me Resh is summed up
Unity uttermost showed, I adore the might of thy breath.....
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@Takamba said
"
@siriusly23 said
"I'd like to discuss Liber Resh from a different point of view. Maybe the Godforms honored aren't the central issue; maybe Resh is actually a tool for helping you to establish a different point of view. I'll explain what I mean. Crowley obviously felt Resh was very important, he made it the fundamental ritual for aspirants to the A.:A.: for example, but the question remains: what is the goal of it? I believe the answer to that question was given by Fr. Achad in an essay titled: "Stepping out of the old aeon and into the new", which Crowley published in The Equinox Vol III, No I. In it Achad suggests that the conception of a dying and resurrected God, which was the central idea of the religion of the old aeon was based on the daily "birth" and "death" of the sun. Since we now understand that the movement of the Earth creates the appearance of the movement of the Sun, we realize that the Sun is always shining on the Earth, at midnight, sunrise, noon, and sunset. If you put this idea clearly in mind, you shift your perspective from the cyclic nature of planetary existence to become a solar being- From Samsara to Moksha, liberation from the cycle of re-birth. Perhaps Resh was designed as a first step toward solar consciousness."How shall I say this to be oh so gentle as possible. ...... uhm..... yeah.
ps. good catch!"
Thanks for your thoughtful comment.
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@Takamba said
"
@siriusly23 said
"I'd like to discuss Liber Resh from a different point of view. Maybe the Godforms honored aren't the central issue; maybe Resh is actually a tool for helping you to establish a different point of view. I'll explain what I mean. Crowley obviously felt Resh was very important, he made it the fundamental ritual for aspirants to the A.:A.: for example, but the question remains: what is the goal of it? I believe the answer to that question was given by Fr. Achad in an essay titled: "Stepping out of the old aeon and into the new", which Crowley published in The Equinox Vol III, No I. In it Achad suggests that the conception of a dying and resurrected God, which was the central idea of the religion of the old aeon was based on the daily "birth" and "death" of the sun. Since we now understand that the movement of the Earth creates the appearance of the movement of the Sun, we realize that the Sun is always shining on the Earth, at midnight, sunrise, noon, and sunset. If you put this idea clearly in mind, you shift your perspective from the cyclic nature of planetary existence to become a solar being- From Samsara to Moksha, liberation from the cycle of re-birth. Perhaps Resh was designed as a first step toward solar consciousness."How shall I say this to be oh so gentle as possible. ...... uhm..... yeah.
ps. good catch!"
Takamba; I don't understand, don't worry about being gentle, I'm serious about this. It seems the necessary shift in perspective could be transformative, no? And, though Achad doesn't mention Resh in the essay, the two fit together too well to be just co-incidence. Or maybe I'm just off my meds again. Siriusly23
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@siriusly23 said
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@Takamba said
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@siriusly23 said
"I'd like to discuss Liber Resh from a different point of view. Maybe the Godforms honored aren't the central issue; maybe Resh is actually a tool for helping you to establish a different point of view. I'll explain what I mean. Crowley obviously felt Resh was very important, he made it the fundamental ritual for aspirants to the A.:A.: for example, but the question remains: what is the goal of it? I believe the answer to that question was given by Fr. Achad in an essay titled: "Stepping out of the old aeon and into the new", which Crowley published in The Equinox Vol III, No I. In it Achad suggests that the conception of a dying and resurrected God, which was the central idea of the religion of the old aeon was based on the daily "birth" and "death" of the sun. Since we now understand that the movement of the Earth creates the appearance of the movement of the Sun, we realize that the Sun is always shining on the Earth, at midnight, sunrise, noon, and sunset. If you put this idea clearly in mind, you shift your perspective from the cyclic nature of planetary existence to become a solar being- From Samsara to Moksha, liberation from the cycle of re-birth. Perhaps Resh was designed as a first step toward solar consciousness."How shall I say this to be oh so gentle as possible. ...... uhm..... yeah.
ps. good catch!"
Takamba; I don't understand, don't worry about being gentle, I'm serious about this. It seems the necessary shift in perspective could be transformative, no? And, though Achad doesn't mention Resh in the essay, the two fit together too well to be just co-incidence. Or maybe I'm just off my meds again. Siriusly23"
All I was saying to you in my original reply is that according to my understanding, you are correct in your current assessment and that my peers agree with me. I said "uhm... yeah" to signify we already accept this. I said "good catch" to congratulate you on your observance. The idea I understand you to be saying is that focusing on the God forms is not the key, but remembering where you are and the sun is in relationship is the key.
There's a further exercise or (for want of better words) procedure I was taught. Observe the visible planets and their current locations at all times. Know where you are in relationship to the Sun, the Moon, Venus, Mercury, Mars, Jupiter and Saturn. Stand where you are and see in your mind their actual locations.
After some time and familiarity with these relationships, incorporate them when you perform Reguli.
Ultimately yes, the work is intended to be transformational (but personally I didn't find it in Resh alone) but you did find the hint and in the right place. That's what I'm saying.
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The procedure (thank you) I was hoping to develop was to identify oneself as a star.
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I have a couple of questions regarding Resh. I figured it would be more appropriate to post them in this thread rather than create my own...
1.) In Liber CC, it says "giving the sign of his grade" several times. What is the practitioner to do if they aren't a member of any order? (like in my case)
2.) Is the practice of Resh something that is usually (or traditionally) recorded in the practitioner's Day Book/Journal? If so, is there to be an entry after every practice (four entries a day) or just one entry covering all four?
Thanks in advance,
-ANEA
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@ANEA said
"1.) In Liber CC, it says "giving the sign of his grade" several times. What is the practitioner to do if they aren't a member of any order? (like in my case)"
Crowley, in marginalia to his own copy of The Equinox, answered this: For those who "have no grade," give the 5=6 signs (LVX) for dawn, 4=7 for noon, 2=9 for sunset, and 3=8 for midnight - as if standing at the intersection of Samekh and Peh.
"2.) Is the practice of Resh something that is usually (or traditionally) recorded in the practitioner's Day Book/Journal? If so, is there to be an entry after every practice (four entries a day) or just one entry covering all four?"
Besides the theory that all practices should be thus recorded, I'd recommend at least recording it for a long stretch (say, a year) during the period of learning and habituation. - After a decade or so, I stopped recording it except when there was a particular reason to do so.
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@Jim Eshelman said
"After a decade or so, I stopped recording it except when there was a particular reason to do so."
This very interesting.. A decade seems like such a long time!
So how did you accomplish this? Did you carry your journal around with you everywhere? Like to work for when you performed Resh in during the afternoon? Or out with you to functions that lasted late into the night (I can't imagine for 10 years you were at your house every night at midnight)?Also, sorry I missed what Crowley said about the signs. Thanks for pointing me in the right direction though!
-ANEA
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@ANEA said
"This very interesting.. A decade seems like such a long time!
So how did you accomplish this? Did you carry your journal around with you everywhere? Like to work for when you performed Resh in during the afternoon? Or out with you to functions that lasted late into the night (I can't imagine for 10 years you were at your house every night at midnight?"Various ways... and, of course, when one has immersed one's life in the Work, there are far more things than Resh that raise these diary questions.
Yes, during some periods I carried my diary with me more or less wherever I went. For much of the time, though, for Resh, all you need is the time. A little pocket notebook served just fine to jot times and a few notes to trigger later, more extensive journalling. Today, with many portable devices, it is even easier... even a cell phone is likely to have a "notes" app to let you jot a few things.
And don't presume that, in that decade, there were 14,608 perfect records of four Reshes a day, every day. But, when one has committed to a practice, it's as important to have a record of what you didn't do as it is to have the record of what you did.
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"Today, with many portable devices, it is even easier... even a cell phone is likely to have a "notes" app to let you jot a few things."
You still believe it should be hand written in detail later though right? I've heard of some people's journals being fully electronic (due to convenience of space/quick searches). Are you saying that you would support that?
I think even recording that you forgot to or were unable to perform Resh still requires some discipline. For some reason I never considered the idea that I may want to record for other things besides practice. Good call on that.
EDIT:
Nevermind, I found a thread already discussing the questions. For anyone else out there who was curious about the same thing, the thread is HERE