Mentally vs Physically Doing Rituals
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Just picking on the actual title "Mentally vs Physically Doing Rituals," there's a vast difference in procedure. And I'm taking mentally as not necessarily meaning astral. A well rehearsed ritual in the physical, without actually working within the astral, is just as much "mentally" only doing the ritual as reading it or planning it is. But if by mentally you mean internally as well as astrally then the difference is not so vast - but there is still a difference. The idea is that an actual ritual work in the physical is also being done with the body of light. One can do the ritual with only the body of light, but it's 'results' as somewhat diminished relative to the strength of the BOL.
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It sounds like he is trying to describe "astrally" doing rituals as compared to using your physical wand/sword or finger.
There are some major differences between these two forms of ritual. Doing them physically is almost like doing them astrally, depending on how psychically open you are. For instance, when I do a ritual in the physical, I have my astral door open to the point where it seems just like I am doing it in the astral, however I am grounding the energy and bringing it to a more solid form which balances me more with my environment and the space around me.
You will just have to practice for yourself. As soon as you start to manifest actual light with tracing pentagrams and hexagrams, and can feel that light during your physical ritual, there's not much difference between the two, in the exact fashion that Takamba has explained above.
If you do in fact mean planning and having the ritual down in your head compared to actually doing the ritual, the ritual does need to be physically and astrally practiced until you do pretty much have it down in your head, and you can evolve from tracing pentagrams (Liber O), to casting them already made in your head (Star Ruby), to having them always mentally and "spiritually" activated where you can just think about it and activate them. The most latter is accomplished much easier with some of our Lady Nuit's "strange drugs" that were revealed to Crowley, most specifically Peyote, (in Crowley's time, the cactus was called anhalonium lewinii. If you wish to follow in our Master Therion's footsteps, and if anhalonium lewinii has been deemed evil in your country of residence, you can search for "San Pedro" or "Peruvian Torch" which is completely legal in about every country.)
Such of Nuit's sacraments will start to permanently open your cerebral cortex which is the part of your brain that controls how much of the rest of your brain you use, as well as tells the rest of your brain "how much" you are sleeping at any given moment. Awakenings occur easily but not without extreme work and preparation from such open minded people as Magicians.
The more experienced you are in one area affects how well you perform in another area, which comes right back to performing astrally or physically.
That's all the basic information I have on this subject pertaining to your exact question in regards to Thelema and the work of our dear Crowley.
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I think there are some references to that question,in the literature.
As they said in the theory, to do some ritual int he astral plane, you have to do all the elements of the same ritual .The only difference is, that it happens in your imagination. So this work is a kind of in the most advanced manner.
And they say that is not for beginners -:)
My writing is more theoretical and less practical based.But you can try, why not.
93
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That could be only a wording , that is,a expression as mental and a astral plane. I would agree whit Takamba on that.
My references are in Huna Magic where some rituals are quite individual ,
and are performed in ones imagination( ho'oponopono, etc.). And Woodo.Some of this things I have picked up from other persons who would know much more on this subject, then I.
93
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Easiest answer : It depends.
If you have never performed the ritual physically, and on a regular basis, doing it mentally will produce limited results.
As you will be leaving out a host of sensations that course through the body (at the same time, you really should not feel anything - the energy should be passing through your physical body without resistance).With experience, a person could perform the ritual mentally while still receiving many of the benefits which come along from performing the ritual physically. This can be achieved though mentally stimulating the physical body ; mentally 'feeling' the effects on the physical form( feel of the breath exiting the lungs as you vibrate, feel of the ground under your feet as you move around the circle , etc).
There are certain facets I am uncertain about...
One of them is spatial recognition, which involves elements of both the physical and mental. -
The body of light spoken of, is, perhaps the composite electrochemical signature of your doing "anything". it's part fractal, and part perception, and in composing the substructure of your doing a ritual, simply reading it with attentive passion can be enough to gain even the most subtle of effects.
The more you involve yourself in the ritual, the more you become the ritual, the more it becomes you, and the less you is left to be you afterwords. A price not considered by many an magi, but which I do consider, though you needen't it's not your burden to be cast with my prices, but it's a thought, which as He himself said could be "Untrue". In my practical considerations, the most precious of moments have been born out of this delicate relationship to "my" own development, and the application of principles so clearly laid before me.
Thus, I could apply this, I could ignore that, but I am drawn to the other solution, for it is smiling, and I welcome a smile. Be it all mental, you will only attain memory, be it physical (not necessarily all, could it be) you will attain practice, but be it both it will be proof, at least to you, and should it be otherwise than the aforenotioned it will be surprise.
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Is there any text or a book about this topic?
I once read a long time ago(a script in foreign translation), that, really the most advanced level of ritual activities, as well as the building of the Temple, is not to physical, but on the the astral plane.
And on the the astral plane you have all the necessary elements, spatial movement, and others.
But this requires the necessary skills to be practiced regularly.
Far as we know in magical rituals there are no elements similar as the influence to the body, or some parts of body, but almost everything happens in the imagination, and the movement of the body is just a helping moment in rituals.
Correct me if I'm wrong.Anyway, I feel that this is a quite complex topics,
I can only pick up the knowledge of other more experienced people on this matter. -:)93
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Mentally you can see a co-ordinate axis of XYZ, but the point at the center is at a 90 degree angle to all the others, as they themselves seem to be less in the picturesque imaging of itself to your perspective, even as they decrease your view of that axis to a point no less in line with your line of sight, equivolent with any other point in the "belly of the axes", but thus is your precious possession now, to see yourself as a line in tandem with the geometrical structure DeCartes wrestled with Angels for. It needen't be time, though time may be an expression there of, and thus give you "physical vehicle" to compose the composite memory-image, now-experience, future-anticipation, all along that axis which is enscribed incrementally into your consciousness, if you allow, for there is now will to you as strong as your own, and I only humbly off this divergent segway into another universe if you so choose.
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@Zazazas214 said
"Mentally you can see a co-ordinate axis of XYZ, but the point at the center is at a 90 degree angle to all the others, as they themselves seem to be less in the picturesque imaging of itself to your perspective, even as they decrease your view of that axis to a point no less in line with your line of sight, equivolent with any other point in the "belly of the axes", but thus is your precious possession now, to see yourself as a line in tandem with the geometrical structure DeCartes wrestled with Angels for. It needen't be time, though time may be an expression there of, and thus give you "physical vehicle" to compose the composite memory-image, now-experience, future-anticipation, all along that axis which is enscribed incrementally into your consciousness, if you allow, for there is now will to you as strong as your own, and I only humbly off this divergent segway into another universe if you so choose."
Nice, but do you ever have been in the astral body, outside of your physical body. Under this intellectual describing there is nothing even close to astral.
But I have nothing to do with the OTO rituals.
You may work them at your will and understanding. -
To Pad!@$, In half-dreamstates, before slumber takes me under like anesthesia to a place I can not even recognize my own hands, I am able, amply, to slough one rough reality for another, slightly smelling, tasting, touching, and hearing the workings of beings other than me. It's much like being both the spigot and the nozzel on a hose, you regulate your involvement (All, some, nothing) on both ends, but how the rain falls no one knows, though there is enough control to get the plants wet, and more importantly the soil.
In these states, which I find easiest and hence most workable, I have ripped holes out of antagonistic universes to more pleasurable ones (I suppose in mortal fear, and how much "mortality" can be experienced in a half-state of consciousness is up to individual experimentation), channel-surfing the "tides and wind-currents"... I can stay in these states as long as I don't fall into the undertow, which usually leads to uncontrollable experiences of "Dream" in which the only connection I have to my body is "waking", a funny enough term for use in this the days of the Supermoon, in it's full presence (how fortunate!).
My experiences in these states are daily, and I work with them the way I work with reality, which is, what is normal to me then is normal to me always, though that is a very obtuse way of talking about it. Perhaps, if I am able, I could say: I live up to the expectations I find I have of me, as my will seeks to transcend them. If I find no expectations I don't live up to anything and the dream dissipates.
I could, and I Will, extrapolate, that the sum level of lack of interesting (to me, as I know of them) expectations of my fellow humans makes me feel that the astral must be a deserted place, as the bulk of the populace is concerned within the cities of popular opiinion and rarely populates the wastes left over from Man's Great Imaginings. A desertification of the astral realm if you will, and this may be due to my own limits, and to a certain degree, not much at all (like the buzzing of a bumblebee's winds have on the weather of Greater Jupiter), on yours.
Expect much of me, and I will deliver to the best of my ability, which is not what you directly asked for, but I don't know why exactly, but it the result of your Will's influence on mine.
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@Zazazas214
eh, i see now.Sorry, I I have not understood you the first time
You know, as you said, it is sometimes difficult in your own words to describe the events from the astral reality.
Interestingly, at a time when the previous message appears,
I had a vivid dream, though it happens often, it was unusual this time.
Perhaps well known synchronicity.regards