Detailed questions on the Klippot
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"“Is this really useful though? It doesn't lead anywhere...you're surrounded and embedded in their domain anyway”"
Precisely because I am in their domain that I need to be able to identify and understand them in my own mythological world view. Without that, I cannot establish a right (at least intellectual) relationship with them (specially my own Qlipoth).
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"Precisely because I am in their domain that I need to be able to identify and understand them in my own mythological world view. Without that, I cannot establish a right (at least intellectual) relationship with them (specially my own Quipploth)"
What bearing do you think that your 'mythological' world view has on them? What do you believe the function
of the Klippot is? Intellectual relationship is one very small part of the whole I think. The real relationship is
when you are confronted with any situation, feeling or thought that separates you from the unity and adhesion
with the Creator, be it anger, confusion, the belief in the Sitra Achra to name a few.Atzilut
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Well, it is quite important to have some knowledge of bacteria when you are choosing your antibiotics.
As far as I know, the very definition of Qlipotic is that they have no function.
Well, since all the problem is that my intuition is not exactly perfect, intellectual apprehension is quite useful to identify a “feeling or thought that separates you from the unity and adhesion with the Creator”.
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Faust,
I think you already know the answers to your questions, and I thought your final post was an astute one.
As with any subject, the knowledge and experience of things evolves, and it is such with the Qliphoth. Just as we know that the "classical" domineering "Solomonic" attitudes towards chthonic spirits isn't necessary (and arguably an hindrance) to truly successful work with them, we know also that Qliphothic work is not without value and can even be of considerable value in some cases, as Jim has suggested. But he is most certainly correct when he says:
"" However, that doesn't mean that it's an approach one would recommend to everybody. ""
If you do feel drawn to this work though, I would suggest the work of Thomas Karlsson, whom I think has been mentioned earlier in the thread, and that of Jake Stratton-Kent.
I will also leave this post with a final thought--its just an idea and I don't preten to assure it has any value--- but it makes sense to me that the greater the solve, the greater the potential for the coagula. And if the qliphoth have one trait or purpose most would agree on, it is a powerful tendency towards the solve.
There are of course these and other words of Liber Tzaddi and other of the beasts works to consider:
"38.
I who am beyond Wisdom and Folly, arise and say unto you: achieve both weddings! Unite yourselves with both!Beware, beware, I say, lest ye seek after the one and lose the other!
40.
My adepts stand upright; their head above the heavens, their feet below the hells.
41.
But since one is naturally attracted to the Angel, another to the Demon, let the first strengthen the lower link, the last attach more firmly to the higher."--Cody
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Thanks for your reply. Interesting. Im still not quite sure how the issue of mythology (Titian or otherwise)
relates to the idea of the Klippot, but would agree with the analogy of the anti-biotic."As far as I know, the very definition of Qlipotic is that they have no function."
The Kabbalistic texts make it very clear that the Klippot do serve a function, but that function exists only as long as Man engages with them without 'correcting' their influence, which is namely, to push Man into the realization of his place and purpose within the scheme. This is not to be interpreted in some vaguely religious ideal, but rather the primary 'magical' means whereby one may move into deeper degrees of realisation, although this may appear very mundane and unglamorous. Once this is achieved, they do, at an individual level, cease to serve any further function.
Atzilut
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I might suggest Rabbi Ashlag's 'Hakadamah l'Panim Meirot uMasbirot' paragraphs 19 and 20 known in English as 'The Introduction to Welcoming and Illuminating Revelations'.
This gives a very short and concise summary of the Sitra Achra and Klipot, without all the unnecessary 'glamour' that surrounds this often
misunderstood topic.Atzilut
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Atzilut
I use the word mythology to speak about a set of symbols and cosmologies used to understand mystical/magical experience. In this sense, Qlipoth are part of the kabalistic mythology.
"but that function exists only as long as Man engages with them without 'correcting' their influence"
What I understand is that they have no function of their own. In this case their function only exist in relationship to us, as a reaction not as an action.
There is a Platonic concept where the universe is built over a hierarchy. Evil only exist as long as a being decides not to take his rightful place is this hierarchy. I believe this understanding is very similar to the kabalistic understanding of the Qliopht.
I will try to get a copy of Sitra Achra and Klipot. Thanks.
poor+blind+misfit
"I think you already know the answers to your questions, and I thought your final post was an astute one."
Thanks
I have serious doubt that a direct work with the Qlipoth would do any good to me in my present level. The operation with the universal Qlipoth would only strengths my unsolved personal Qlipoth, making me more likely to be enslaved by them.
Something like trying to put a end to poverty in Africa without ending with my own poverty first.
I will take a look on those books.
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Faust
Thank you for explaining...it's a little clearer now. What I would say is that we tend to view the Klippot as
something mythological, imagining all sorts of things like the fantastical creatures of the Goetia, when the
reality of the presence in our lives is often far more mundane. However, I do feel, that initially, we need to
use our imaginative faculties to develop a sensory awareness of those deeper more occluded sensations within
us until such time as the distinction between the inner and outer worlds disappears.Atzilut
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I had a thought recently that my habitual ways of thinking and doing things are Qliphoth. That the Qliphoth are (some of) our thoughts.
--C
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The forthcoming book by ixaxaar may shed additional light on the qlipphoth: The Book of Sitra Achra.