Can one get far with just the "big blue book"?
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I don't want to join anything, get abused by weirdos or have sex magic with other thelemites as part of any advancement rites (or whatever). I do still find myself interested in Crowley, though, and finally feel that I have no reservations left about dealing with possibly demonic entities, although the goetia is not really anything I'm interested in.
So, if I want to practice Crowley's brand of magic, is the big blue book all I need? Or is it basically useless if I don't participate in group activity within authentic AA lineage?
Thanks!
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There is no group activity in formal A.'.A.'. work.
And yes, you can do a lot just from the book. One component missing is perspective - a sane sense of when something has been mastered, for example. Outside perspective is very useful for this. But, if you don't have someone in that role, then you have to heighten the standard to which you hold yourself on the matter.
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"I don't want to join anything, get abused by weirdos or have sex magic with other thelemites as part of any advancement rites (or whatever)."
Wow, while understanding why this perspective maybe out there, I am not too sure why it is perpetuated. Fear mongering I say. Group work is a very effective way of walking the path, especially in the early stages. I have been doing it for a long time and none of your fears have ever been present in any group that I have worked in.
Laziness is a whole other thing.
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From my research when I was actually considering joining a group, I found that there are plenty of weirdos and total nutjobs out there who do weird crap invovled with supposedly authentic OTOs and AAs who are just wackjobs. And once I realized this, I just became wary about any group connected with Crowley. Being a "nice guy" was not a prerequisite for being a prophet of the new aeon. Unfortunately, his reputation attracts a lot of "colorful characters," too. Just visiting the OTO in Queens requires one to sign a waiver that basically entitles them to do anything they want to you and protects them legally in case of your death.
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Yeah, I have heard of such things. I just have not experienced them. I suppose things are a bit different here in California. You had to sign a waiver to visit, WOW. I do not think that gives them free reign, it would just cover their ass, I see that as being two different things. What I think one should consider is that the OTO is not technically group work. The OTO is a social/political order that does have initiation and magic going on, and a number of factions that have differing ideas of how things should be. The focus is not on building group mind or a particular group process, it is about the fabric of a Thelemic community; that is different.
I can tell you there is a group of people doing good safe group work in the NY area.
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Yes - a decent working magical group. I've found some OTO nearby but I've never really felt a connection with them. I wasn't aware there was a CoT campus near Phili - I could perhaps make a trip up there on occasion.
Thanks for the help either way Jim. At least I have heruraha.net
JG
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WOW! you didnt like william blake?? thats where i took all my OTO inits so far, and i find them very friendly and great people, as well as some very knowledgable people. but that was my experience. and each star may experience things diffferently.
93s
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bethata418 -
Sorry, I wasn't clear. I've never met the OTO in the DC area, I just don't feel a connection to the OTO in general. It comes from encounters with them in LA, along with careful scrutiny of some of their lesser known by-laws. I honestly don't have time for group affiliation now anyway, my solo path, while slow, has yielded fruit. Plus, I have 2 small children, which makes it difficult for me to attend functions. Maybe in a few years.
JG
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@Jim Eshelman said
"There is no group activity in formal A.'.A.'. work.
And yes, you can do a lot just from the book. One component missing is perspective - a sane sense of when something has been mastered, for example. Outside perspective is very useful for this. But, if you don't have someone in that role, then you have to heighten the standard to which you hold yourself on the matter."
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law.
To this end, could some more experienced practicianers, perhaps through experiment, come up with some tangible tests for mastery of the basic rituals, for those of us who remain untutored. ie "If you have mastered the Star Ruby, you should be able to banish your pet cat from the house," etc. I suppose I should ask: are any experimental affirmations fundamentally practical?
Love is the law, love under will.
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Well I tried to give you the secret of advancement, but I guess the Mods didn't like that.
As my post is gone.
If its such a guarded secret I guess I will not reveal it, save to in the context of an exclusive order, to initiates deemed worthy and prepared for it.
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@jlpugh said
"\To this end, could some more experienced practicianers, perhaps through experiment, come up with some tangible tests for mastery of the basic rituals, for those of us who remain untutored. ie "If you have mastered the Star Ruby, you should be able to banish your pet cat from the house," etc. I suppose I should ask: are any experimental affirmations fundamentally practical?"
LOL. That' not a purpose of that ritual (as I think you know).
Nearly all of the "standardized tests" are published. Very few are not. In this case, Star Ruby is examined only as part of a syllabus item, not as a core task. Some Superiors might not test it at all - others test by watching performance - others may ask technical questions about it - others may use the record to evaluate some feature of results. The main point though is that it's examined only as one of the syllabus items, not as a primary task.
In any case, technical proficiency in the individual tasks isn't the whole story. Or, when it is the whole story, there's still the question of outside perspective. Continually living inside the elevator shaft of one's own box-reality makes it harder to have right-perspective on one's work. This increases vulnerability to ego-inflation and misinterpretation.
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@Redd Fezz said
"Just visiting the OTO in Queens requires one to sign a waiver that basically entitles them to do anything they want to you and protects them legally in case of your death."
When I applied for initiation into a thelemic order (name withheld to protect the innocent), I had to sign a scary waiver. It mentioned that people have been known to become injured when "participating in this kind of activity", and -- yes -- protected the order legally in case of my death. Signing the waiver was really an initiation in itself, and signified my degree of trust in the people involved. Afterwards, I learned that the text of the waiver had been taken, with slight modifications, from a waiver parents have to sign for their kids to play on a high school soccer team.
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@Jim Eshelman said
"There is no group activity in formal A.'.A.'. work.
"
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law
ah, with respect, we do in fact reformulate once a year. it's the only time A.'.A.'. members work with each other in a temple in an official manner.
however, attendence isn't required.
if you don't want to do group work i Highly recommend A.'.A.'., but then again i Would so take that with however many grains of salt you wish
Love is the law, love under will
LIHF -
I signed the same waiver,,it,s just a legal thing. Remember the Golden Rule,, COVER THINE ASS!!!
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oops, sorry, meant to send a pm don't know how I posted here. lol.
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If you can get far with only the Liber ABA, then more power to you. I have had to read plenty of other books in order to understand plenty of what I've read, and I haven't even gotten through the entire Liber ABA yet.
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luxinhominefactum wrote:
"if you don't want to do group work i Highly recommend A.'.A.'., but then again i Would so take that with however many grains of salt you wish . "
And just so you know...I am not picking on your Soror.
It appears you are an excellent trigger for my internal contemplations this evening...KUDOS!
That said, you wrote: ..."if you don't want to do group work i Highly recommend A.'.A.'..."
Well, if you don't consider HUMANITY group work, than I would most certainly agree. But, the work of the A.'.A.'. is about the evolution of Humanity...and that to me is one large group.
That said, it is important that we recognize to whom we serve in this tradition of the Silver Star.
49!
