Intoning/Vibrating the Divine Names
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Not at all. If I had to rely on ONE ritual as a fall back for all situations, it's the ONLY candidate on my list.
How could something like this be "outdated"?
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I'm not an authority, by any means. I'm pretty new to all this. But it doesn't seem like something has to be new or specifically use Thelemic names to be Thelemic. The purpose of the the ritual is Thelemic, and as far as I can tell it's an important one to get down before moving on to more complex practices. Crowley suggested everybody commit it to memory, which is enough for me.
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@Dar es Allrah said
"Its not a Thelemic ritual. It's pre-new-aeon. 1870- 1880's?"
But is it *un-*Thelemic? I would hold that it isn't. And I certainly wouldn't set a standard of just replacing everything because it's old. In this case, the ritual has numerous inherent virtues that aren't matched by anything else known to me.
BTW Liber Israfel isn't "new aeon" by time frame. It's an Allen Bennett ritual from his Golden Dawn days (1890s).
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In agreement, or rather, to spring-board from what Jim is saying <vbg>, I quote Liber AL II:5
Behold! the rituals of the old time are black. Let the evil ones be cast away; let the good ones be purged by the prophet! Then shall this Knowledge go aright.
Now note it does not say, "Let all the rituals of the old time be cast away," but the evil ones - and with the good ones they will be "purged" (made clean of the dross).
Maybe in the Aeon of Ma'at we will have Logan's Run for rituals, but not yet.
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If I'm understanding you correctly... I don't find any of that to be true at all. Quito the contrary, actually. It tightly affirms one's relationship to one's core. It's also a ritual tightly affirming one's relationship to the HGA. (Insidiously: It's valuable that it isn't terribly obvious in this regard.)
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He was writing a joke book <vbg>.
BTW, although he wrote two versions of the Star Ruby, there's no evidence I can find that he ever performed it. It certainly wasn't standard for him. In the late '30s or early '40s, when he sent study materials to the O.T.O. Lodge in Southern California, it was specifically the Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram that he sent - along with a new brief commentary.
And, as you of course know, you and I completely disagree on the Hebrew thing.
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My way of looking at is, without any attachment to the ritual, the angels, anything, is it's a tool. I've studied a lot of different banishing rituals and none of them seem to come close to replacing the LBRP. But, like I said, I'm not an expert. I'm also not too concerned about every ritual being a specifically Thelemic one. I'm willing to use any and all tools at my disposal to aid me in the discovery of my True Will and the Work in general. Until I come across a better ritual to replace it I'm going to be using the Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram. So, while I'm working with it, I'd like to learn as much as I can to make sure I'm performing it correctly.
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I have been using the updated Qabalistic Cross, but I've been touching my chest when I intone Aiwass, not the throat.
As far as the exact reason, Aiwass I get, but touching my genitals and intoning Malkuth is still a little beyond me.
But I will admit I haven't spent any time researching or looking into why Malkuth is intoned at the genitals, I just ran with it. I've been spending all my time working on how to properly vibrate everything in the ritual.
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@00000 said
"I have been using the updated Qabalistic Cross, but I've been touching my chest when I intone Aiwass, not the throat."
Yes, the mid-sternum region, i.e., heart. That's correct.
"As far as the exact reason, Aiwass I get, but touching my genitals and intoning Malkuth is still a little beyond me."
Since the visualizations that accompany this have the energy flowing all the way to the feet, the simplest explanation is pragmatic: That's as far as the hand conveniently reaches.
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I wonder if you're confusing it with Liber Reguli? For the Pentagram Ritual, it's always (from Crowley) been the heart.
The heart is for Tiphereth . The adept, who knows the HGA's name, uses that name at the heart (in private). Prior to that (or for the adept who is working in a group context), "Aiwass" is used in lieu. The name equates to 93 in Hebre and 418 in Greek, and so embodies the whole of the Thelemic current.
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Another question I have about "Attah Gibbor le-Olahm Adonai" is when it comes to vibration, is this entire statement broken up like "AH-DOH-NAH-YEE," or just Adonai? Like with the archangels how "before me, behind me, etc." is normal and just the names are specially vibrated.
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@00000 said
"Another question I have about "Attah Gibbor le-Olahm Adonai" is when it comes to vibration, is this entire statement broken up like "AH-DOH-NAH-YEE," or just Adonai? Like with the archangels how "before me, behind me, etc." is normal and just the names are specially vibrated."
Yes. Broken up one syllable at a time. Yes, the words are spoken normal, you only vibrate the divine names.
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@00000 said
"Another question I have about "Attah Gibbor le-Olahm Adonai" is when it comes to vibration, is this entire statement broken up like "AH-DOH-NAH-YEE," or just Adonai?"
It tends to be vibrated more briskly, more like a sentence rather than even syllables, until the Adonai (which then gets the full treatment). I'm not sure I've ever heard A.G.L.A. (by which I mean the whole sentence) ever done letter-by-letter. Two syllables, two syllables, three syllables, then let her rip letter by letter on Adonai.
A good guide is that each Divine Name takes about the same amount of time and breath. Therefore, Eheyeh is more drawn out, Attah Gibbor le-Olahm Adonai is a said more briskly. (I just timed myself at my own normal pace, and Eheyeh took 6 seconds, A.G.L.A. took 8. (The other two take me 5 or 6 seconds.)
"Like with the archangels how "before me, behind me, etc." is normal and just the names are specially vibrated."
Exactly. (Or the textual part has a different quality of voice, a slightly chanty, resonant form.) If using melodic vibration (each Hebrew letter receiving its corresponding note), then the textual parts are chanted on a C-natural (for red).
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They have their own material, often not standard. (That's not a criticism or a compliment per se. <g>)
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@Dar es Allrah said
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@Jim Eshelman said
"They have their own material, often not standard. (That's not a criticism or a compliment per se. <g>)"Lol. Is that Motta's lineage behind the library?"
No, I don't think there's any main cross-over. (Could be wrong.) Here's the registration information for the domain ownership:
Aeonic Systems N Khuit Box 1087 Port Alberni British Columbia V9Y 7L9 Canada -
@Jim Eshelman said
"It tends to be vibrated more briskly, more like a sentence rather than even syllables, until the Adonai (which then gets the full treatment). I'm not sure I've ever heard A.G.L.A. (by which I mean the whole sentence) ever done letter-by-letter. Two syllables, two syllables, three syllables, then let her rip letter by letter on Adonai.
"Thank you. Between this and the other thread Avshalom Binyamin pointed me to, I'm good. I really appreciate all the help and information.
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Why? "Fourfold" means there are four parts. There are four words in Atah Gibor Le-Olahm Adonai.
