Finding my True Will
-
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law,
I am happy to report that I am at last living the dream!
This year, as of January 1st, I have gone on the dole, and I am now using all my time to pursue The Great Work.
I have gone through initiation in both the local O.T.O. body, and luckily, I have now also become a probationer of an A'.'A.'.-lineage. My dream is happening, and I can honestly say, I have never been happier in my life
Today, however my old job called and wanted to hear if I could come back this autumn to continue working for them. I told them it was a little early in the year for me to decide, but I felt the pressure to decide; rather sooner than later ..
I was planning to use my year off also to look for alternative ways of earning a living, but perhaps I will have to come up with some new strategy for that sooner than I thought.My question is about the "True Will" ..
Namely - how do I find it!? ..
What little advice I get from the O.T.O. community, has to do with focusing on "Pure" Will, rather than "True" Will. (That is - as I drop more and more things I discover to be NOT my Will, the "Pure Will" gradually becomes visible)
As I understand it, The Great Work is a lot about working with perspectives, and is more of a tool for discovering the True Will, than it is a candidate for the True Will itself? .. I think the reason why I enjoy doing The Great Work so much, is because it prompts me to move towards the discovery of my True Will, and not because "this is it", as they say (?) .. (Or perhaps it is? - I don't know) ..
Even though I enjoy something as much as this, how do I know if it's really my "True Will"?
Is the True Will something I discover, or something I choose?
The way I hope this could work out is:
- I discover my True Will.
- I get the "momentum of the Universe" at my back.
- I continue doing my Will, which would necessarily include continually finding progressively more optimal synthesis of earning a living and at the same time doing my Will more and more strongly and effectively ..
- Ideally, I would never have to do meaningless work (as in work only for the money - selling my time on earth like a common whore
.. ) again, without this work at least having at least some connection to me doing my Will in some way .. - I would like to be the source of my activities (which would of course include procuring money in some way), rather than a "hand for hire" of some other Will.
Then there is the question about accepting money for spiritual advice .. Over time, I could perhaps set myself up as a guru of some sort, but I think it would be a bad mistake to do this "for a living" ..
Sorry for the long post and scattered questions..
I guess what it boils down to is this:
I am feeling so free, so lucky to be able to structure my days and my work myself .. I feel like something is beginning to pouring out from inside, rather than me just reacting to forces shaping my existence from the outside ..
I dread the prospect of taking a step back again this autumn, and I am desperately looking for a way to take control over my life, to be the source of the happening, rather than the receiver. I imagine - if I could find out the Truth about my existence, I would be able to take the step up and remain in this mode of life, even in the face of the necessity of earning money ..As always, any advice is highly appreciated.
Love is the law, love under will,
Frater Katanoese@Los said
"
@chris S said
"So when you give your opinion that the Temple of Thelema forum is a fruitcake factory that produces fruitcakes (it was superficially funny ).. Is that opinion based on sound evidence or do just prefer/like saying it?"I'm glad you found it funny. My goal is ever to instruct and to delight.
I'd like to answer this question, but I'm not quite sure how directly I can state my honest answer without being booted off the forums and having my entire posting history wiped. To be sure, I don't intend to "attack" anybody personally, but I'm pretty sure that the honest answer will at least be perceived as hostile.
If you're really curious about the answer, ask me on my blog. It might be more fun to just imagine what I'd say, though."
Well i dont want to goad you into saying something that would bring about you getting booted off the forum..
I read your blog yes, it concerned providing humour for your readers.
It's just my contention that you havn't entered the forum with your attitude Tabula rasa.. for instance your insistance on using the term Goblins as a generic stand in for sarcasm.. nobody mentioned Goblins, in fact Simon asked you stop using that term as it sounded idiotic.
So sure, i dont feel you want to attack anyone individually, you're just being generally sarcastic.But i'm getting off topic from this thread.
-
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law,
I am happy to report that I am at last living the dream!
This year, as of January 1st, I have gone on the dole, and I am now using all my time to pursue The Great Work.
I have gone through initiation in both the local O.T.O. body, and luckily, I have now also become a probationer of an A'.'A.'.-lineage. My dream is happening, and I can honestly say, I have never been happier in my lifeToday, however my old job called and wanted to hear if I could come back this autumn to continue working for them. I told them it was a little early in the year for me to decide, but I felt the pressure to decide; rather sooner than later ..
I was planning to use my year off also to look for alternative ways of earning a living, but perhaps I will have to come up with some new strategy for that sooner than I thought.My question is about the "True Will" ..
Namely - how do I find it!? ..What little advice I get from the O.T.O. community, has to do with focusing on "Pure" Will, rather than "True" Will. (That is - as I drop more and more things I discover to be NOT my Will, the "Pure Will" gradually becomes visible)
As I understand it, The Great Work is a lot about working with perspectives, and is more of a tool for discovering the True Will, than it is a candidate for the True Will itself? .. I think the reason why I enjoy doing The Great Work so much, is because it prompts me to move towards the discovery of my True Will, and not because "this is it", as they say (?) .. (Or perhaps it is? - I don't know) ..
Even though I enjoy something as much as this, how do I know if it's really my "True Will"?
Is the True Will something I discover, or something I choose?
The way I hope this could work out is:
- I discover my True Will.
- I get the "momentum of the Universe" at my back.
- I continue doing my Will, which would necessarily include continually finding progressively more optimal synthesis of earning a living and at the same time doing my Will more and more strongly and effectively ..
- Ideally, I would never have to do meaningless work (as in work only for the money - selling my time on earth like a common whore .. ) again, without this work at least having at least some connection to me doing my Will in some way ..
- I would like to be the source of my activities (which would of course include procuring money in some way), rather than a "hand for hire" of some other Will.
Then there is the question about accepting money for spiritual advice .. Over time, I could perhaps set myself up as a guru of some sort, but I think it would be a bad mistake to do this "for a living" ..
Sorry for the long post and scattered questions..
I guess what it boils down to is this:
I am feeling so free, so lucky to be able to structure my days and my work myself .. I feel like something is beginning to pouring out from inside, rather than me just reacting to forces shaping my existence from the outside ..
I dread the prospect of taking a step back again this autumn, and I am desperately looking for a way to take control over my life, to be the source of the happening, rather than the receiver. I imagine - if I could find out the Truth about my existence, I would be able to take the step up and remain in this mode of life, even in the face of the necessity of earning money ..As always, any advice is highly appreciated.
Love is the law, love under will,
Frater Katanoese -
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law,
I am happy to report that I am at last living the dream!
This year, as of January 1st, I have gone on the dole, and I am now using all my time to pursue The Great Work.
I have gone through initiation in both the local O.T.O. body, and luckily, I have now also become a probationer of an A'.'A.'.-lineage. My dream is happening, and I can honestly say, I have never been happier in my lifeToday, however my old job called and wanted to hear if I could come back this autumn to continue working for them. I told them it was a little early in the year for me to decide, but I felt the pressure to decide; rather sooner than later ..
I was planning to use my year off also to look for alternative ways of earning a living, but perhaps I will have to come up with some new strategy for that sooner than I thought.My question is about the "True Will" ..
Namely - how do I find it!? ..What little advice I get from the O.T.O. community, has to do with focusing on "Pure" Will, rather than "True" Will. (That is - as I drop more and more things I discover to be NOT my Will, the "Pure Will" gradually becomes visible)
As I understand it, The Great Work is a lot about working with perspectives, and is more of a tool for discovering the True Will, than it is a candidate for the True Will itself? .. I think the reason why I enjoy doing The Great Work so much, is because it prompts me to move towards the discovery of my True Will, and not because "this is it", as they say (?) .. (Or perhaps it is? - I don't know) ..
Even though I enjoy something as much as this, how do I know if it's really my "True Will"?
Is the True Will something I discover, or something I choose?
The way I hope this could work out is:
- I discover my True Will.
- I get the "momentum of the Universe" at my back.
- I continue doing my Will, which would necessarily include continually finding progressively more optimal synthesis of earning a living and at the same time doing my Will more and more strongly and effectively ..
- Ideally, I would never have to do meaningless work (as in work only for the money - selling my time on earth like a common whore .. ) again, without this work at least having at least some connection to me doing my Will in some way ..
- I would like to be the source of my activities (which would of course include procuring money in some way), rather than a "hand for hire" of some other Will.
Then there is the question about accepting money for spiritual advice .. Over time, I could perhaps set myself up as a guru of some sort, but I think it would be a bad mistake to do this "for a living" ..
Sorry for the long post and scattered questions..
I guess what it boils down to is this:
I am feeling so free, so lucky to be able to structure my days and my work myself .. I feel like something is beginning to pouring out from inside, rather than me just reacting to forces shaping my existence from the outside ..
I dread the prospect of taking a step back again this autumn, and I am desperately looking for a way to take control over my life, to be the source of the happening, rather than the receiver. I imagine - if I could find out the Truth about my existence, I would be able to take the step up and remain in this mode of life, even in the face of the necessity of earning money ..As always, any advice is highly appreciated.
Love is the law, love under will,
Frater KatanoeseFood for thought:
Given: Experiences have no explanatory power.
Premise: Experiences have no explanatory power.
Premise: Meditation yields experiences.
Conclusion: Meditation yields experiences, which have no explanatory power.Premise: Experiences have no explanatory power.
Premise: Ritual yields experiences.
Conclusion: Ritual yields experiences, which have no explanatory power.Premise: Meditation yields experiences, which have no explanatory power.
Premise: Ritual yields experiences, which have no explanatory power.
Conclusion: Meditation and ritual both yield experiences, which have no explanatory power.
Given: Gaining knowledge of one's True Will requires experiences.
Premise: Gaining knowledge of one's True Will requires experiences.
Premise: Experiences have no explanatory power.
Conclusion: Gaining knowledge of one's True Will requires experiences, which have no explanatory power.
Given: Knowledge is appropriately pursued through the means required to gain it.
Premise: Knowledge is appropriately pursued through the means required to gain it.
Premise: Gaining knowledge of one's True Will requires experiences, which have no explanatory power.
Conclusion: Gaining knowledge of one's True Will is appropriately pursued through the means of experiences, which have no explanatory power.
Premise: Gaining knowledge of one's True Will is appropriately pursued through the means of experiences, which have no explanatory power.
Premise: Meditation and ritual both yield experiences, which have no explanatory power.
Conclusion: Gaining knowledge of one's True Will is appropriately pursued through the experiences yielded by both meditation and ritual even though these experiences have no explanatory power. -
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law,
I am happy to report that I am at last living the dream!
This year, as of January 1st, I have gone on the dole, and I am now using all my time to pursue The Great Work.
I have gone through initiation in both the local O.T.O. body, and luckily, I have now also become a probationer of an A'.'A.'.-lineage. My dream is happening, and I can honestly say, I have never been happier in my lifeToday, however my old job called and wanted to hear if I could come back this autumn to continue working for them. I told them it was a little early in the year for me to decide, but I felt the pressure to decide; rather sooner than later ..
I was planning to use my year off also to look for alternative ways of earning a living, but perhaps I will have to come up with some new strategy for that sooner than I thought.My question is about the "True Will" ..
Namely - how do I find it!? ..What little advice I get from the O.T.O. community, has to do with focusing on "Pure" Will, rather than "True" Will. (That is - as I drop more and more things I discover to be NOT my Will, the "Pure Will" gradually becomes visible)
As I understand it, The Great Work is a lot about working with perspectives, and is more of a tool for discovering the True Will, than it is a candidate for the True Will itself? .. I think the reason why I enjoy doing The Great Work so much, is because it prompts me to move towards the discovery of my True Will, and not because "this is it", as they say (?) .. (Or perhaps it is? - I don't know) ..
Even though I enjoy something as much as this, how do I know if it's really my "True Will"?
Is the True Will something I discover, or something I choose?
The way I hope this could work out is:
- I discover my True Will.
- I get the "momentum of the Universe" at my back.
- I continue doing my Will, which would necessarily include continually finding progressively more optimal synthesis of earning a living and at the same time doing my Will more and more strongly and effectively ..
- Ideally, I would never have to do meaningless work (as in work only for the money - selling my time on earth like a common whore .. ) again, without this work at least having at least some connection to me doing my Will in some way ..
- I would like to be the source of my activities (which would of course include procuring money in some way), rather than a "hand for hire" of some other Will.
Then there is the question about accepting money for spiritual advice .. Over time, I could perhaps set myself up as a guru of some sort, but I think it would be a bad mistake to do this "for a living" ..
Sorry for the long post and scattered questions..
I guess what it boils down to is this:
I am feeling so free, so lucky to be able to structure my days and my work myself .. I feel like something is beginning to pouring out from inside, rather than me just reacting to forces shaping my existence from the outside ..
I dread the prospect of taking a step back again this autumn, and I am desperately looking for a way to take control over my life, to be the source of the happening, rather than the receiver. I imagine - if I could find out the Truth about my existence, I would be able to take the step up and remain in this mode of life, even in the face of the necessity of earning money ..As always, any advice is highly appreciated.
Love is the law, love under will,
Frater Katanoese -
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law,
I am happy to report that I am at last living the dream!
This year, as of January 1st, I have gone on the dole, and I am now using all my time to pursue The Great Work.
I have gone through initiation in both the local O.T.O. body, and luckily, I have now also become a probationer of an A'.'A.'.-lineage. My dream is happening, and I can honestly say, I have never been happier in my lifeToday, however my old job called and wanted to hear if I could come back this autumn to continue working for them. I told them it was a little early in the year for me to decide, but I felt the pressure to decide; rather sooner than later ..
I was planning to use my year off also to look for alternative ways of earning a living, but perhaps I will have to come up with some new strategy for that sooner than I thought.My question is about the "True Will" ..
Namely - how do I find it!? ..What little advice I get from the O.T.O. community, has to do with focusing on "Pure" Will, rather than "True" Will. (That is - as I drop more and more things I discover to be NOT my Will, the "Pure Will" gradually becomes visible)
As I understand it, The Great Work is a lot about working with perspectives, and is more of a tool for discovering the True Will, than it is a candidate for the True Will itself? .. I think the reason why I enjoy doing The Great Work so much, is because it prompts me to move towards the discovery of my True Will, and not because "this is it", as they say (?) .. (Or perhaps it is? - I don't know) ..
Even though I enjoy something as much as this, how do I know if it's really my "True Will"?
Is the True Will something I discover, or something I choose?
The way I hope this could work out is:
- I discover my True Will.
- I get the "momentum of the Universe" at my back.
- I continue doing my Will, which would necessarily include continually finding progressively more optimal synthesis of earning a living and at the same time doing my Will more and more strongly and effectively ..
- Ideally, I would never have to do meaningless work (as in work only for the money - selling my time on earth like a common whore .. ) again, without this work at least having at least some connection to me doing my Will in some way ..
- I would like to be the source of my activities (which would of course include procuring money in some way), rather than a "hand for hire" of some other Will.
Then there is the question about accepting money for spiritual advice .. Over time, I could perhaps set myself up as a guru of some sort, but I think it would be a bad mistake to do this "for a living" ..
Sorry for the long post and scattered questions..
I guess what it boils down to is this:
I am feeling so free, so lucky to be able to structure my days and my work myself .. I feel like something is beginning to pouring out from inside, rather than me just reacting to forces shaping my existence from the outside ..
I dread the prospect of taking a step back again this autumn, and I am desperately looking for a way to take control over my life, to be the source of the happening, rather than the receiver. I imagine - if I could find out the Truth about my existence, I would be able to take the step up and remain in this mode of life, even in the face of the necessity of earning money ..As always, any advice is highly appreciated.
Love is the law, love under will,
Frater Katanoese -
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law,
I am happy to report that I am at last living the dream!
This year, as of January 1st, I have gone on the dole, and I am now using all my time to pursue The Great Work.
I have gone through initiation in both the local O.T.O. body, and luckily, I have now also become a probationer of an A'.'A.'.-lineage. My dream is happening, and I can honestly say, I have never been happier in my lifeToday, however my old job called and wanted to hear if I could come back this autumn to continue working for them. I told them it was a little early in the year for me to decide, but I felt the pressure to decide; rather sooner than later ..
I was planning to use my year off also to look for alternative ways of earning a living, but perhaps I will have to come up with some new strategy for that sooner than I thought.My question is about the "True Will" ..
Namely - how do I find it!? ..What little advice I get from the O.T.O. community, has to do with focusing on "Pure" Will, rather than "True" Will. (That is - as I drop more and more things I discover to be NOT my Will, the "Pure Will" gradually becomes visible)
As I understand it, The Great Work is a lot about working with perspectives, and is more of a tool for discovering the True Will, than it is a candidate for the True Will itself? .. I think the reason why I enjoy doing The Great Work so much, is because it prompts me to move towards the discovery of my True Will, and not because "this is it", as they say (?) .. (Or perhaps it is? - I don't know) ..
Even though I enjoy something as much as this, how do I know if it's really my "True Will"?
Is the True Will something I discover, or something I choose?
The way I hope this could work out is:
- I discover my True Will.
- I get the "momentum of the Universe" at my back.
- I continue doing my Will, which would necessarily include continually finding progressively more optimal synthesis of earning a living and at the same time doing my Will more and more strongly and effectively ..
- Ideally, I would never have to do meaningless work (as in work only for the money - selling my time on earth like a common whore .. ) again, without this work at least having at least some connection to me doing my Will in some way ..
- I would like to be the source of my activities (which would of course include procuring money in some way), rather than a "hand for hire" of some other Will.
Then there is the question about accepting money for spiritual advice .. Over time, I could perhaps set myself up as a guru of some sort, but I think it would be a bad mistake to do this "for a living" ..
Sorry for the long post and scattered questions..
I guess what it boils down to is this:
I am feeling so free, so lucky to be able to structure my days and my work myself .. I feel like something is beginning to pouring out from inside, rather than me just reacting to forces shaping my existence from the outside ..
I dread the prospect of taking a step back again this autumn, and I am desperately looking for a way to take control over my life, to be the source of the happening, rather than the receiver. I imagine - if I could find out the Truth about my existence, I would be able to take the step up and remain in this mode of life, even in the face of the necessity of earning money ..As always, any advice is highly appreciated.
Love is the law, love under will,
Frater Katanoese@Faus said
"@Berashith
That is something that actually sounds like logic.(Just to remember something Simon already said somewhere, there is no such thing as âexplanatory powerâ, only predictive power)"
Well... first of all... a "given" is just a "given" and is only relevant to those who agree with it.
But also, ...even if there is no such thing as "explanatory power," then it's still true that experiences don't have it.
-
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law,
I am happy to report that I am at last living the dream!
This year, as of January 1st, I have gone on the dole, and I am now using all my time to pursue The Great Work.
I have gone through initiation in both the local O.T.O. body, and luckily, I have now also become a probationer of an A'.'A.'.-lineage. My dream is happening, and I can honestly say, I have never been happier in my lifeToday, however my old job called and wanted to hear if I could come back this autumn to continue working for them. I told them it was a little early in the year for me to decide, but I felt the pressure to decide; rather sooner than later ..
I was planning to use my year off also to look for alternative ways of earning a living, but perhaps I will have to come up with some new strategy for that sooner than I thought.My question is about the "True Will" ..
Namely - how do I find it!? ..What little advice I get from the O.T.O. community, has to do with focusing on "Pure" Will, rather than "True" Will. (That is - as I drop more and more things I discover to be NOT my Will, the "Pure Will" gradually becomes visible)
As I understand it, The Great Work is a lot about working with perspectives, and is more of a tool for discovering the True Will, than it is a candidate for the True Will itself? .. I think the reason why I enjoy doing The Great Work so much, is because it prompts me to move towards the discovery of my True Will, and not because "this is it", as they say (?) .. (Or perhaps it is? - I don't know) ..
Even though I enjoy something as much as this, how do I know if it's really my "True Will"?
Is the True Will something I discover, or something I choose?
The way I hope this could work out is:
- I discover my True Will.
- I get the "momentum of the Universe" at my back.
- I continue doing my Will, which would necessarily include continually finding progressively more optimal synthesis of earning a living and at the same time doing my Will more and more strongly and effectively ..
- Ideally, I would never have to do meaningless work (as in work only for the money - selling my time on earth like a common whore .. ) again, without this work at least having at least some connection to me doing my Will in some way ..
- I would like to be the source of my activities (which would of course include procuring money in some way), rather than a "hand for hire" of some other Will.
Then there is the question about accepting money for spiritual advice .. Over time, I could perhaps set myself up as a guru of some sort, but I think it would be a bad mistake to do this "for a living" ..
Sorry for the long post and scattered questions..
I guess what it boils down to is this:
I am feeling so free, so lucky to be able to structure my days and my work myself .. I feel like something is beginning to pouring out from inside, rather than me just reacting to forces shaping my existence from the outside ..
I dread the prospect of taking a step back again this autumn, and I am desperately looking for a way to take control over my life, to be the source of the happening, rather than the receiver. I imagine - if I could find out the Truth about my existence, I would be able to take the step up and remain in this mode of life, even in the face of the necessity of earning money ..As always, any advice is highly appreciated.
Love is the law, love under will,
Frater Katanoese -
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law,
I am happy to report that I am at last living the dream!
This year, as of January 1st, I have gone on the dole, and I am now using all my time to pursue The Great Work.
I have gone through initiation in both the local O.T.O. body, and luckily, I have now also become a probationer of an A'.'A.'.-lineage. My dream is happening, and I can honestly say, I have never been happier in my lifeToday, however my old job called and wanted to hear if I could come back this autumn to continue working for them. I told them it was a little early in the year for me to decide, but I felt the pressure to decide; rather sooner than later ..
I was planning to use my year off also to look for alternative ways of earning a living, but perhaps I will have to come up with some new strategy for that sooner than I thought.My question is about the "True Will" ..
Namely - how do I find it!? ..What little advice I get from the O.T.O. community, has to do with focusing on "Pure" Will, rather than "True" Will. (That is - as I drop more and more things I discover to be NOT my Will, the "Pure Will" gradually becomes visible)
As I understand it, The Great Work is a lot about working with perspectives, and is more of a tool for discovering the True Will, than it is a candidate for the True Will itself? .. I think the reason why I enjoy doing The Great Work so much, is because it prompts me to move towards the discovery of my True Will, and not because "this is it", as they say (?) .. (Or perhaps it is? - I don't know) ..
Even though I enjoy something as much as this, how do I know if it's really my "True Will"?
Is the True Will something I discover, or something I choose?
The way I hope this could work out is:
- I discover my True Will.
- I get the "momentum of the Universe" at my back.
- I continue doing my Will, which would necessarily include continually finding progressively more optimal synthesis of earning a living and at the same time doing my Will more and more strongly and effectively ..
- Ideally, I would never have to do meaningless work (as in work only for the money - selling my time on earth like a common whore .. ) again, without this work at least having at least some connection to me doing my Will in some way ..
- I would like to be the source of my activities (which would of course include procuring money in some way), rather than a "hand for hire" of some other Will.
Then there is the question about accepting money for spiritual advice .. Over time, I could perhaps set myself up as a guru of some sort, but I think it would be a bad mistake to do this "for a living" ..
Sorry for the long post and scattered questions..
I guess what it boils down to is this:
I am feeling so free, so lucky to be able to structure my days and my work myself .. I feel like something is beginning to pouring out from inside, rather than me just reacting to forces shaping my existence from the outside ..
I dread the prospect of taking a step back again this autumn, and I am desperately looking for a way to take control over my life, to be the source of the happening, rather than the receiver. I imagine - if I could find out the Truth about my existence, I would be able to take the step up and remain in this mode of life, even in the face of the necessity of earning money ..As always, any advice is highly appreciated.
Love is the law, love under will,
Frater Katanoese@Bereshith said
"Well... first of all... a "given" is just a "given" and is only relevant to those who agree with it."
So if I fall down a six metres high wall without braking the landing will only affect me adversely if I agree with that?
You are aware that you are indirectly claiming that there are no objective things, just subjective perspectives, yes?
-
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law,
I am happy to report that I am at last living the dream!
This year, as of January 1st, I have gone on the dole, and I am now using all my time to pursue The Great Work.
I have gone through initiation in both the local O.T.O. body, and luckily, I have now also become a probationer of an A'.'A.'.-lineage. My dream is happening, and I can honestly say, I have never been happier in my lifeToday, however my old job called and wanted to hear if I could come back this autumn to continue working for them. I told them it was a little early in the year for me to decide, but I felt the pressure to decide; rather sooner than later ..
I was planning to use my year off also to look for alternative ways of earning a living, but perhaps I will have to come up with some new strategy for that sooner than I thought.My question is about the "True Will" ..
Namely - how do I find it!? ..What little advice I get from the O.T.O. community, has to do with focusing on "Pure" Will, rather than "True" Will. (That is - as I drop more and more things I discover to be NOT my Will, the "Pure Will" gradually becomes visible)
As I understand it, The Great Work is a lot about working with perspectives, and is more of a tool for discovering the True Will, than it is a candidate for the True Will itself? .. I think the reason why I enjoy doing The Great Work so much, is because it prompts me to move towards the discovery of my True Will, and not because "this is it", as they say (?) .. (Or perhaps it is? - I don't know) ..
Even though I enjoy something as much as this, how do I know if it's really my "True Will"?
Is the True Will something I discover, or something I choose?
The way I hope this could work out is:
- I discover my True Will.
- I get the "momentum of the Universe" at my back.
- I continue doing my Will, which would necessarily include continually finding progressively more optimal synthesis of earning a living and at the same time doing my Will more and more strongly and effectively ..
- Ideally, I would never have to do meaningless work (as in work only for the money - selling my time on earth like a common whore .. ) again, without this work at least having at least some connection to me doing my Will in some way ..
- I would like to be the source of my activities (which would of course include procuring money in some way), rather than a "hand for hire" of some other Will.
Then there is the question about accepting money for spiritual advice .. Over time, I could perhaps set myself up as a guru of some sort, but I think it would be a bad mistake to do this "for a living" ..
Sorry for the long post and scattered questions..
I guess what it boils down to is this:
I am feeling so free, so lucky to be able to structure my days and my work myself .. I feel like something is beginning to pouring out from inside, rather than me just reacting to forces shaping my existence from the outside ..
I dread the prospect of taking a step back again this autumn, and I am desperately looking for a way to take control over my life, to be the source of the happening, rather than the receiver. I imagine - if I could find out the Truth about my existence, I would be able to take the step up and remain in this mode of life, even in the face of the necessity of earning money ..As always, any advice is highly appreciated.
Love is the law, love under will,
Frater Katanoese@Simon Iff said
"
So if I fall down a six metres high wall without braking the landing will only affect me adversely if I agree with that?"Well, if you are on morphine there is a good chance you will not understand it as adverse. But there is the great chance that you will change your mind after the effect goes away.
-
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law,
I am happy to report that I am at last living the dream!
This year, as of January 1st, I have gone on the dole, and I am now using all my time to pursue The Great Work.
I have gone through initiation in both the local O.T.O. body, and luckily, I have now also become a probationer of an A'.'A.'.-lineage. My dream is happening, and I can honestly say, I have never been happier in my lifeToday, however my old job called and wanted to hear if I could come back this autumn to continue working for them. I told them it was a little early in the year for me to decide, but I felt the pressure to decide; rather sooner than later ..
I was planning to use my year off also to look for alternative ways of earning a living, but perhaps I will have to come up with some new strategy for that sooner than I thought.My question is about the "True Will" ..
Namely - how do I find it!? ..What little advice I get from the O.T.O. community, has to do with focusing on "Pure" Will, rather than "True" Will. (That is - as I drop more and more things I discover to be NOT my Will, the "Pure Will" gradually becomes visible)
As I understand it, The Great Work is a lot about working with perspectives, and is more of a tool for discovering the True Will, than it is a candidate for the True Will itself? .. I think the reason why I enjoy doing The Great Work so much, is because it prompts me to move towards the discovery of my True Will, and not because "this is it", as they say (?) .. (Or perhaps it is? - I don't know) ..
Even though I enjoy something as much as this, how do I know if it's really my "True Will"?
Is the True Will something I discover, or something I choose?
The way I hope this could work out is:
- I discover my True Will.
- I get the "momentum of the Universe" at my back.
- I continue doing my Will, which would necessarily include continually finding progressively more optimal synthesis of earning a living and at the same time doing my Will more and more strongly and effectively ..
- Ideally, I would never have to do meaningless work (as in work only for the money - selling my time on earth like a common whore .. ) again, without this work at least having at least some connection to me doing my Will in some way ..
- I would like to be the source of my activities (which would of course include procuring money in some way), rather than a "hand for hire" of some other Will.
Then there is the question about accepting money for spiritual advice .. Over time, I could perhaps set myself up as a guru of some sort, but I think it would be a bad mistake to do this "for a living" ..
Sorry for the long post and scattered questions..
I guess what it boils down to is this:
I am feeling so free, so lucky to be able to structure my days and my work myself .. I feel like something is beginning to pouring out from inside, rather than me just reacting to forces shaping my existence from the outside ..
I dread the prospect of taking a step back again this autumn, and I am desperately looking for a way to take control over my life, to be the source of the happening, rather than the receiver. I imagine - if I could find out the Truth about my existence, I would be able to take the step up and remain in this mode of life, even in the face of the necessity of earning money ..As always, any advice is highly appreciated.
Love is the law, love under will,
Frater Katanoese@Bereshith said
"Also... I haven't worked through it yet, but.... it seems at some point, one would have to say that knowledge of one's True Will necessarily makes use of projected meaning.
"Good point. Meaning is distinctly a relationship between you and an experience, as is knowledge in general.
The strange effect in this case can be the fact that the TW is (as far as I know) the primal source of meanings that we attribute to stuff around us. -
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law,
I am happy to report that I am at last living the dream!
This year, as of January 1st, I have gone on the dole, and I am now using all my time to pursue The Great Work.
I have gone through initiation in both the local O.T.O. body, and luckily, I have now also become a probationer of an A'.'A.'.-lineage. My dream is happening, and I can honestly say, I have never been happier in my lifeToday, however my old job called and wanted to hear if I could come back this autumn to continue working for them. I told them it was a little early in the year for me to decide, but I felt the pressure to decide; rather sooner than later ..
I was planning to use my year off also to look for alternative ways of earning a living, but perhaps I will have to come up with some new strategy for that sooner than I thought.My question is about the "True Will" ..
Namely - how do I find it!? ..What little advice I get from the O.T.O. community, has to do with focusing on "Pure" Will, rather than "True" Will. (That is - as I drop more and more things I discover to be NOT my Will, the "Pure Will" gradually becomes visible)
As I understand it, The Great Work is a lot about working with perspectives, and is more of a tool for discovering the True Will, than it is a candidate for the True Will itself? .. I think the reason why I enjoy doing The Great Work so much, is because it prompts me to move towards the discovery of my True Will, and not because "this is it", as they say (?) .. (Or perhaps it is? - I don't know) ..
Even though I enjoy something as much as this, how do I know if it's really my "True Will"?
Is the True Will something I discover, or something I choose?
The way I hope this could work out is:
- I discover my True Will.
- I get the "momentum of the Universe" at my back.
- I continue doing my Will, which would necessarily include continually finding progressively more optimal synthesis of earning a living and at the same time doing my Will more and more strongly and effectively ..
- Ideally, I would never have to do meaningless work (as in work only for the money - selling my time on earth like a common whore .. ) again, without this work at least having at least some connection to me doing my Will in some way ..
- I would like to be the source of my activities (which would of course include procuring money in some way), rather than a "hand for hire" of some other Will.
Then there is the question about accepting money for spiritual advice .. Over time, I could perhaps set myself up as a guru of some sort, but I think it would be a bad mistake to do this "for a living" ..
Sorry for the long post and scattered questions..
I guess what it boils down to is this:
I am feeling so free, so lucky to be able to structure my days and my work myself .. I feel like something is beginning to pouring out from inside, rather than me just reacting to forces shaping my existence from the outside ..
I dread the prospect of taking a step back again this autumn, and I am desperately looking for a way to take control over my life, to be the source of the happening, rather than the receiver. I imagine - if I could find out the Truth about my existence, I would be able to take the step up and remain in this mode of life, even in the face of the necessity of earning money ..As always, any advice is highly appreciated.
Love is the law, love under will,
Frater Katanoese@Simon Iff said
"
@Bereshith said
"Well... first of all... a "given" is just a "given" and is only relevant to those who agree with it."So if I fall down a six metres high wall without braking the landing will only affect me adversely if I agree with that?
You are aware that you are indirectly claiming that there are no objective things, just subjective perspectives, yes?"
I'm speaking within the context of following the logic of a syllogism. The givens are only meaningful for those who agree with them. I'm not attempting to speak to the objectivity of all givens ever given.
-
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law,
I am happy to report that I am at last living the dream!
This year, as of January 1st, I have gone on the dole, and I am now using all my time to pursue The Great Work.
I have gone through initiation in both the local O.T.O. body, and luckily, I have now also become a probationer of an A'.'A.'.-lineage. My dream is happening, and I can honestly say, I have never been happier in my lifeToday, however my old job called and wanted to hear if I could come back this autumn to continue working for them. I told them it was a little early in the year for me to decide, but I felt the pressure to decide; rather sooner than later ..
I was planning to use my year off also to look for alternative ways of earning a living, but perhaps I will have to come up with some new strategy for that sooner than I thought.My question is about the "True Will" ..
Namely - how do I find it!? ..What little advice I get from the O.T.O. community, has to do with focusing on "Pure" Will, rather than "True" Will. (That is - as I drop more and more things I discover to be NOT my Will, the "Pure Will" gradually becomes visible)
As I understand it, The Great Work is a lot about working with perspectives, and is more of a tool for discovering the True Will, than it is a candidate for the True Will itself? .. I think the reason why I enjoy doing The Great Work so much, is because it prompts me to move towards the discovery of my True Will, and not because "this is it", as they say (?) .. (Or perhaps it is? - I don't know) ..
Even though I enjoy something as much as this, how do I know if it's really my "True Will"?
Is the True Will something I discover, or something I choose?
The way I hope this could work out is:
- I discover my True Will.
- I get the "momentum of the Universe" at my back.
- I continue doing my Will, which would necessarily include continually finding progressively more optimal synthesis of earning a living and at the same time doing my Will more and more strongly and effectively ..
- Ideally, I would never have to do meaningless work (as in work only for the money - selling my time on earth like a common whore .. ) again, without this work at least having at least some connection to me doing my Will in some way ..
- I would like to be the source of my activities (which would of course include procuring money in some way), rather than a "hand for hire" of some other Will.
Then there is the question about accepting money for spiritual advice .. Over time, I could perhaps set myself up as a guru of some sort, but I think it would be a bad mistake to do this "for a living" ..
Sorry for the long post and scattered questions..
I guess what it boils down to is this:
I am feeling so free, so lucky to be able to structure my days and my work myself .. I feel like something is beginning to pouring out from inside, rather than me just reacting to forces shaping my existence from the outside ..
I dread the prospect of taking a step back again this autumn, and I am desperately looking for a way to take control over my life, to be the source of the happening, rather than the receiver. I imagine - if I could find out the Truth about my existence, I would be able to take the step up and remain in this mode of life, even in the face of the necessity of earning money ..As always, any advice is highly appreciated.
Love is the law, love under will,
Frater KatanoeseThe meaning is its use.. Language doesnt function to a preset pattern, thinking has to to take place within the activity rather than on some intellectual platform suspended outside of life and beyond lived activity.
This where the verificationist types have to be cautious when they condemn religious language as meaningless, have they assumed too quickly what religious language is and does, and how it actually functions in the lives within those activities? -
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law,
I am happy to report that I am at last living the dream!
This year, as of January 1st, I have gone on the dole, and I am now using all my time to pursue The Great Work.
I have gone through initiation in both the local O.T.O. body, and luckily, I have now also become a probationer of an A'.'A.'.-lineage. My dream is happening, and I can honestly say, I have never been happier in my lifeToday, however my old job called and wanted to hear if I could come back this autumn to continue working for them. I told them it was a little early in the year for me to decide, but I felt the pressure to decide; rather sooner than later ..
I was planning to use my year off also to look for alternative ways of earning a living, but perhaps I will have to come up with some new strategy for that sooner than I thought.My question is about the "True Will" ..
Namely - how do I find it!? ..What little advice I get from the O.T.O. community, has to do with focusing on "Pure" Will, rather than "True" Will. (That is - as I drop more and more things I discover to be NOT my Will, the "Pure Will" gradually becomes visible)
As I understand it, The Great Work is a lot about working with perspectives, and is more of a tool for discovering the True Will, than it is a candidate for the True Will itself? .. I think the reason why I enjoy doing The Great Work so much, is because it prompts me to move towards the discovery of my True Will, and not because "this is it", as they say (?) .. (Or perhaps it is? - I don't know) ..
Even though I enjoy something as much as this, how do I know if it's really my "True Will"?
Is the True Will something I discover, or something I choose?
The way I hope this could work out is:
- I discover my True Will.
- I get the "momentum of the Universe" at my back.
- I continue doing my Will, which would necessarily include continually finding progressively more optimal synthesis of earning a living and at the same time doing my Will more and more strongly and effectively ..
- Ideally, I would never have to do meaningless work (as in work only for the money - selling my time on earth like a common whore .. ) again, without this work at least having at least some connection to me doing my Will in some way ..
- I would like to be the source of my activities (which would of course include procuring money in some way), rather than a "hand for hire" of some other Will.
Then there is the question about accepting money for spiritual advice .. Over time, I could perhaps set myself up as a guru of some sort, but I think it would be a bad mistake to do this "for a living" ..
Sorry for the long post and scattered questions..
I guess what it boils down to is this:
I am feeling so free, so lucky to be able to structure my days and my work myself .. I feel like something is beginning to pouring out from inside, rather than me just reacting to forces shaping my existence from the outside ..
I dread the prospect of taking a step back again this autumn, and I am desperately looking for a way to take control over my life, to be the source of the happening, rather than the receiver. I imagine - if I could find out the Truth about my existence, I would be able to take the step up and remain in this mode of life, even in the face of the necessity of earning money ..As always, any advice is highly appreciated.
Love is the law, love under will,
Frater Katanoese@Bereshith said
"Food for thought"
Junk food, maybe.
"Meditation yields experiences, which have no explanatory power."
Right. The experience, all by itself, can't tell you what it was.
It's reasoning about the experience, after the fact, that stands a chance of telling you what it was.
If you look at the OP of the "Experience Has No Explanatory Power" thread, you'll see I give an example of Crowley appealing to this same principle, pointing out that the "experiences" of Mohammed and Christ, all by themselves, couldn't have told them that they "really" experienced Gabriel of Jehovah.
-
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law,
I am happy to report that I am at last living the dream!
This year, as of January 1st, I have gone on the dole, and I am now using all my time to pursue The Great Work.
I have gone through initiation in both the local O.T.O. body, and luckily, I have now also become a probationer of an A'.'A.'.-lineage. My dream is happening, and I can honestly say, I have never been happier in my lifeToday, however my old job called and wanted to hear if I could come back this autumn to continue working for them. I told them it was a little early in the year for me to decide, but I felt the pressure to decide; rather sooner than later ..
I was planning to use my year off also to look for alternative ways of earning a living, but perhaps I will have to come up with some new strategy for that sooner than I thought.My question is about the "True Will" ..
Namely - how do I find it!? ..What little advice I get from the O.T.O. community, has to do with focusing on "Pure" Will, rather than "True" Will. (That is - as I drop more and more things I discover to be NOT my Will, the "Pure Will" gradually becomes visible)
As I understand it, The Great Work is a lot about working with perspectives, and is more of a tool for discovering the True Will, than it is a candidate for the True Will itself? .. I think the reason why I enjoy doing The Great Work so much, is because it prompts me to move towards the discovery of my True Will, and not because "this is it", as they say (?) .. (Or perhaps it is? - I don't know) ..
Even though I enjoy something as much as this, how do I know if it's really my "True Will"?
Is the True Will something I discover, or something I choose?
The way I hope this could work out is:
- I discover my True Will.
- I get the "momentum of the Universe" at my back.
- I continue doing my Will, which would necessarily include continually finding progressively more optimal synthesis of earning a living and at the same time doing my Will more and more strongly and effectively ..
- Ideally, I would never have to do meaningless work (as in work only for the money - selling my time on earth like a common whore .. ) again, without this work at least having at least some connection to me doing my Will in some way ..
- I would like to be the source of my activities (which would of course include procuring money in some way), rather than a "hand for hire" of some other Will.
Then there is the question about accepting money for spiritual advice .. Over time, I could perhaps set myself up as a guru of some sort, but I think it would be a bad mistake to do this "for a living" ..
Sorry for the long post and scattered questions..
I guess what it boils down to is this:
I am feeling so free, so lucky to be able to structure my days and my work myself .. I feel like something is beginning to pouring out from inside, rather than me just reacting to forces shaping my existence from the outside ..
I dread the prospect of taking a step back again this autumn, and I am desperately looking for a way to take control over my life, to be the source of the happening, rather than the receiver. I imagine - if I could find out the Truth about my existence, I would be able to take the step up and remain in this mode of life, even in the face of the necessity of earning money ..As always, any advice is highly appreciated.
Love is the law, love under will,
Frater KatanoeseNo what I meant by predictive value was, that anything, be it a model or idea about something else, irrelevant if the something else is objective, subjective, astral, religious, scientific in the hard sense, etc. - if it wants to be of value - must be able to make a prediction about its topic on the plane it is on or it is worthless drivel.
Examples:
A loves me. -> Testable prediction: A will behave really nice towards me, at least given time.
B's aura looks weak in the chest department. -> Testable prediction: B might have an illness or psychosomatic problem centered on their chest area, or might soon develop one.
If I let object C (say, a vase) go on a high cliff on earth it will most likely shatter and, for sure, arrive on the foot of the cliff soon afterwards. -> Testable prediction: C will perhaps shatter and surely fall if I let go under mentioned circumstances.
My self D is of a kind that I react really angry when someone does something particularly stupid. -> Testable prediction: I will get angry if someone does something I consider stupid.
These sentences above therefore have predictive value on their level, and can be veri- or falsified.
Other example:
Aliens from Sirius, that have secretly taken over earth, are watching me on this internet forum. -> Testable prediction: None. Untestable as such - useless drivel.
All clear Bereshit & co.? This is what I meant - the predictive value of any idea - or not - is relevant even if you do not agree. And that is very useful when differentiating chaff from wheat in many endeavours - including those which Los thinks don't exist.
Clearer what I meant?
-
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law,
I am happy to report that I am at last living the dream!
This year, as of January 1st, I have gone on the dole, and I am now using all my time to pursue The Great Work.
I have gone through initiation in both the local O.T.O. body, and luckily, I have now also become a probationer of an A'.'A.'.-lineage. My dream is happening, and I can honestly say, I have never been happier in my lifeToday, however my old job called and wanted to hear if I could come back this autumn to continue working for them. I told them it was a little early in the year for me to decide, but I felt the pressure to decide; rather sooner than later ..
I was planning to use my year off also to look for alternative ways of earning a living, but perhaps I will have to come up with some new strategy for that sooner than I thought.My question is about the "True Will" ..
Namely - how do I find it!? ..What little advice I get from the O.T.O. community, has to do with focusing on "Pure" Will, rather than "True" Will. (That is - as I drop more and more things I discover to be NOT my Will, the "Pure Will" gradually becomes visible)
As I understand it, The Great Work is a lot about working with perspectives, and is more of a tool for discovering the True Will, than it is a candidate for the True Will itself? .. I think the reason why I enjoy doing The Great Work so much, is because it prompts me to move towards the discovery of my True Will, and not because "this is it", as they say (?) .. (Or perhaps it is? - I don't know) ..
Even though I enjoy something as much as this, how do I know if it's really my "True Will"?
Is the True Will something I discover, or something I choose?
The way I hope this could work out is:
- I discover my True Will.
- I get the "momentum of the Universe" at my back.
- I continue doing my Will, which would necessarily include continually finding progressively more optimal synthesis of earning a living and at the same time doing my Will more and more strongly and effectively ..
- Ideally, I would never have to do meaningless work (as in work only for the money - selling my time on earth like a common whore .. ) again, without this work at least having at least some connection to me doing my Will in some way ..
- I would like to be the source of my activities (which would of course include procuring money in some way), rather than a "hand for hire" of some other Will.
Then there is the question about accepting money for spiritual advice .. Over time, I could perhaps set myself up as a guru of some sort, but I think it would be a bad mistake to do this "for a living" ..
Sorry for the long post and scattered questions..
I guess what it boils down to is this:
I am feeling so free, so lucky to be able to structure my days and my work myself .. I feel like something is beginning to pouring out from inside, rather than me just reacting to forces shaping my existence from the outside ..
I dread the prospect of taking a step back again this autumn, and I am desperately looking for a way to take control over my life, to be the source of the happening, rather than the receiver. I imagine - if I could find out the Truth about my existence, I would be able to take the step up and remain in this mode of life, even in the face of the necessity of earning money ..As always, any advice is highly appreciated.
Love is the law, love under will,
Frater Katanoese -
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law,
I am happy to report that I am at last living the dream!
This year, as of January 1st, I have gone on the dole, and I am now using all my time to pursue The Great Work.
I have gone through initiation in both the local O.T.O. body, and luckily, I have now also become a probationer of an A'.'A.'.-lineage. My dream is happening, and I can honestly say, I have never been happier in my lifeToday, however my old job called and wanted to hear if I could come back this autumn to continue working for them. I told them it was a little early in the year for me to decide, but I felt the pressure to decide; rather sooner than later ..
I was planning to use my year off also to look for alternative ways of earning a living, but perhaps I will have to come up with some new strategy for that sooner than I thought.My question is about the "True Will" ..
Namely - how do I find it!? ..What little advice I get from the O.T.O. community, has to do with focusing on "Pure" Will, rather than "True" Will. (That is - as I drop more and more things I discover to be NOT my Will, the "Pure Will" gradually becomes visible)
As I understand it, The Great Work is a lot about working with perspectives, and is more of a tool for discovering the True Will, than it is a candidate for the True Will itself? .. I think the reason why I enjoy doing The Great Work so much, is because it prompts me to move towards the discovery of my True Will, and not because "this is it", as they say (?) .. (Or perhaps it is? - I don't know) ..
Even though I enjoy something as much as this, how do I know if it's really my "True Will"?
Is the True Will something I discover, or something I choose?
The way I hope this could work out is:
- I discover my True Will.
- I get the "momentum of the Universe" at my back.
- I continue doing my Will, which would necessarily include continually finding progressively more optimal synthesis of earning a living and at the same time doing my Will more and more strongly and effectively ..
- Ideally, I would never have to do meaningless work (as in work only for the money - selling my time on earth like a common whore .. ) again, without this work at least having at least some connection to me doing my Will in some way ..
- I would like to be the source of my activities (which would of course include procuring money in some way), rather than a "hand for hire" of some other Will.
Then there is the question about accepting money for spiritual advice .. Over time, I could perhaps set myself up as a guru of some sort, but I think it would be a bad mistake to do this "for a living" ..
Sorry for the long post and scattered questions..
I guess what it boils down to is this:
I am feeling so free, so lucky to be able to structure my days and my work myself .. I feel like something is beginning to pouring out from inside, rather than me just reacting to forces shaping my existence from the outside ..
I dread the prospect of taking a step back again this autumn, and I am desperately looking for a way to take control over my life, to be the source of the happening, rather than the receiver. I imagine - if I could find out the Truth about my existence, I would be able to take the step up and remain in this mode of life, even in the face of the necessity of earning money ..As always, any advice is highly appreciated.
Love is the law, love under will,
Frater Katanoese@Simon Iff said
"
@Los said
"
@Bereshith said
"Food for thought"Junk food, maybe."
Los ... has someone explained the function of manners to you at any point in your life?
"Indeed.. And it illustrates my point, that its the behaviour of the individual that puts the experience.. that actual activity, into context.
Reasoning after only routinises the experience into an everyday language.
Compartmentalising the activity and removing it from its context after the fact as Los does wont tell you anything.
For instance he's either being rude, or he has no idea that he's being rude. -
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law,
I am happy to report that I am at last living the dream!
This year, as of January 1st, I have gone on the dole, and I am now using all my time to pursue The Great Work.
I have gone through initiation in both the local O.T.O. body, and luckily, I have now also become a probationer of an A'.'A.'.-lineage. My dream is happening, and I can honestly say, I have never been happier in my lifeToday, however my old job called and wanted to hear if I could come back this autumn to continue working for them. I told them it was a little early in the year for me to decide, but I felt the pressure to decide; rather sooner than later ..
I was planning to use my year off also to look for alternative ways of earning a living, but perhaps I will have to come up with some new strategy for that sooner than I thought.My question is about the "True Will" ..
Namely - how do I find it!? ..What little advice I get from the O.T.O. community, has to do with focusing on "Pure" Will, rather than "True" Will. (That is - as I drop more and more things I discover to be NOT my Will, the "Pure Will" gradually becomes visible)
As I understand it, The Great Work is a lot about working with perspectives, and is more of a tool for discovering the True Will, than it is a candidate for the True Will itself? .. I think the reason why I enjoy doing The Great Work so much, is because it prompts me to move towards the discovery of my True Will, and not because "this is it", as they say (?) .. (Or perhaps it is? - I don't know) ..
Even though I enjoy something as much as this, how do I know if it's really my "True Will"?
Is the True Will something I discover, or something I choose?
The way I hope this could work out is:
- I discover my True Will.
- I get the "momentum of the Universe" at my back.
- I continue doing my Will, which would necessarily include continually finding progressively more optimal synthesis of earning a living and at the same time doing my Will more and more strongly and effectively ..
- Ideally, I would never have to do meaningless work (as in work only for the money - selling my time on earth like a common whore .. ) again, without this work at least having at least some connection to me doing my Will in some way ..
- I would like to be the source of my activities (which would of course include procuring money in some way), rather than a "hand for hire" of some other Will.
Then there is the question about accepting money for spiritual advice .. Over time, I could perhaps set myself up as a guru of some sort, but I think it would be a bad mistake to do this "for a living" ..
Sorry for the long post and scattered questions..
I guess what it boils down to is this:
I am feeling so free, so lucky to be able to structure my days and my work myself .. I feel like something is beginning to pouring out from inside, rather than me just reacting to forces shaping my existence from the outside ..
I dread the prospect of taking a step back again this autumn, and I am desperately looking for a way to take control over my life, to be the source of the happening, rather than the receiver. I imagine - if I could find out the Truth about my existence, I would be able to take the step up and remain in this mode of life, even in the face of the necessity of earning money ..As always, any advice is highly appreciated.
Love is the law, love under will,
Frater Katanoese@Los said
"Right. The experience, all by itself, can't tell you what it was.
It's reasoning about the experience, after the fact, that stands a chance of telling you what it was.
"Yes, precisely, and the above argument demonstrates that the same is true for both kinds of experiences.
Therefore, since the discernment process is always expected to require* "reasoning about the experience, after the fact," then either both types of experiences may legitimately be used in gaining knowledge of one's True Will, or neither type of experience may legitimately be used.
*No one here argues against this. That's one of your strawmen, along with "goblins."
-
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law,
I am happy to report that I am at last living the dream!
This year, as of January 1st, I have gone on the dole, and I am now using all my time to pursue The Great Work.
I have gone through initiation in both the local O.T.O. body, and luckily, I have now also become a probationer of an A'.'A.'.-lineage. My dream is happening, and I can honestly say, I have never been happier in my lifeToday, however my old job called and wanted to hear if I could come back this autumn to continue working for them. I told them it was a little early in the year for me to decide, but I felt the pressure to decide; rather sooner than later ..
I was planning to use my year off also to look for alternative ways of earning a living, but perhaps I will have to come up with some new strategy for that sooner than I thought.My question is about the "True Will" ..
Namely - how do I find it!? ..What little advice I get from the O.T.O. community, has to do with focusing on "Pure" Will, rather than "True" Will. (That is - as I drop more and more things I discover to be NOT my Will, the "Pure Will" gradually becomes visible)
As I understand it, The Great Work is a lot about working with perspectives, and is more of a tool for discovering the True Will, than it is a candidate for the True Will itself? .. I think the reason why I enjoy doing The Great Work so much, is because it prompts me to move towards the discovery of my True Will, and not because "this is it", as they say (?) .. (Or perhaps it is? - I don't know) ..
Even though I enjoy something as much as this, how do I know if it's really my "True Will"?
Is the True Will something I discover, or something I choose?
The way I hope this could work out is:
- I discover my True Will.
- I get the "momentum of the Universe" at my back.
- I continue doing my Will, which would necessarily include continually finding progressively more optimal synthesis of earning a living and at the same time doing my Will more and more strongly and effectively ..
- Ideally, I would never have to do meaningless work (as in work only for the money - selling my time on earth like a common whore .. ) again, without this work at least having at least some connection to me doing my Will in some way ..
- I would like to be the source of my activities (which would of course include procuring money in some way), rather than a "hand for hire" of some other Will.
Then there is the question about accepting money for spiritual advice .. Over time, I could perhaps set myself up as a guru of some sort, but I think it would be a bad mistake to do this "for a living" ..
Sorry for the long post and scattered questions..
I guess what it boils down to is this:
I am feeling so free, so lucky to be able to structure my days and my work myself .. I feel like something is beginning to pouring out from inside, rather than me just reacting to forces shaping my existence from the outside ..
I dread the prospect of taking a step back again this autumn, and I am desperately looking for a way to take control over my life, to be the source of the happening, rather than the receiver. I imagine - if I could find out the Truth about my existence, I would be able to take the step up and remain in this mode of life, even in the face of the necessity of earning money ..As always, any advice is highly appreciated.
Love is the law, love under will,
Frater Katanoese -
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law,
I am happy to report that I am at last living the dream!
This year, as of January 1st, I have gone on the dole, and I am now using all my time to pursue The Great Work.
I have gone through initiation in both the local O.T.O. body, and luckily, I have now also become a probationer of an A'.'A.'.-lineage. My dream is happening, and I can honestly say, I have never been happier in my lifeToday, however my old job called and wanted to hear if I could come back this autumn to continue working for them. I told them it was a little early in the year for me to decide, but I felt the pressure to decide; rather sooner than later ..
I was planning to use my year off also to look for alternative ways of earning a living, but perhaps I will have to come up with some new strategy for that sooner than I thought.My question is about the "True Will" ..
Namely - how do I find it!? ..What little advice I get from the O.T.O. community, has to do with focusing on "Pure" Will, rather than "True" Will. (That is - as I drop more and more things I discover to be NOT my Will, the "Pure Will" gradually becomes visible)
As I understand it, The Great Work is a lot about working with perspectives, and is more of a tool for discovering the True Will, than it is a candidate for the True Will itself? .. I think the reason why I enjoy doing The Great Work so much, is because it prompts me to move towards the discovery of my True Will, and not because "this is it", as they say (?) .. (Or perhaps it is? - I don't know) ..
Even though I enjoy something as much as this, how do I know if it's really my "True Will"?
Is the True Will something I discover, or something I choose?
The way I hope this could work out is:
- I discover my True Will.
- I get the "momentum of the Universe" at my back.
- I continue doing my Will, which would necessarily include continually finding progressively more optimal synthesis of earning a living and at the same time doing my Will more and more strongly and effectively ..
- Ideally, I would never have to do meaningless work (as in work only for the money - selling my time on earth like a common whore .. ) again, without this work at least having at least some connection to me doing my Will in some way ..
- I would like to be the source of my activities (which would of course include procuring money in some way), rather than a "hand for hire" of some other Will.
Then there is the question about accepting money for spiritual advice .. Over time, I could perhaps set myself up as a guru of some sort, but I think it would be a bad mistake to do this "for a living" ..
Sorry for the long post and scattered questions..
I guess what it boils down to is this:
I am feeling so free, so lucky to be able to structure my days and my work myself .. I feel like something is beginning to pouring out from inside, rather than me just reacting to forces shaping my existence from the outside ..
I dread the prospect of taking a step back again this autumn, and I am desperately looking for a way to take control over my life, to be the source of the happening, rather than the receiver. I imagine - if I could find out the Truth about my existence, I would be able to take the step up and remain in this mode of life, even in the face of the necessity of earning money ..As always, any advice is highly appreciated.
Love is the law, love under will,
Frater Katanoese@Bereshith said
"Yes, precisely, and the above argument demonstrates that the same is true for both kinds of experiences. "
It doesn't demonstrate anything of the kind. You're just baldly asserting that the "experience" of ritual can enable a person to discover the True Will.
Someone could just as easily argue that taking out the garbage is an experience that has no explanatory power. Discovering the True Will requires experiences, which have no explanatory power. Discovering the True Will requires taking out the garbage, which has no explanatory power.
It's nonsense. You can say it, but that doesn't make it correct.
-
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law,
I am happy to report that I am at last living the dream!
This year, as of January 1st, I have gone on the dole, and I am now using all my time to pursue The Great Work.
I have gone through initiation in both the local O.T.O. body, and luckily, I have now also become a probationer of an A'.'A.'.-lineage. My dream is happening, and I can honestly say, I have never been happier in my lifeToday, however my old job called and wanted to hear if I could come back this autumn to continue working for them. I told them it was a little early in the year for me to decide, but I felt the pressure to decide; rather sooner than later ..
I was planning to use my year off also to look for alternative ways of earning a living, but perhaps I will have to come up with some new strategy for that sooner than I thought.My question is about the "True Will" ..
Namely - how do I find it!? ..What little advice I get from the O.T.O. community, has to do with focusing on "Pure" Will, rather than "True" Will. (That is - as I drop more and more things I discover to be NOT my Will, the "Pure Will" gradually becomes visible)
As I understand it, The Great Work is a lot about working with perspectives, and is more of a tool for discovering the True Will, than it is a candidate for the True Will itself? .. I think the reason why I enjoy doing The Great Work so much, is because it prompts me to move towards the discovery of my True Will, and not because "this is it", as they say (?) .. (Or perhaps it is? - I don't know) ..
Even though I enjoy something as much as this, how do I know if it's really my "True Will"?
Is the True Will something I discover, or something I choose?
The way I hope this could work out is:
- I discover my True Will.
- I get the "momentum of the Universe" at my back.
- I continue doing my Will, which would necessarily include continually finding progressively more optimal synthesis of earning a living and at the same time doing my Will more and more strongly and effectively ..
- Ideally, I would never have to do meaningless work (as in work only for the money - selling my time on earth like a common whore .. ) again, without this work at least having at least some connection to me doing my Will in some way ..
- I would like to be the source of my activities (which would of course include procuring money in some way), rather than a "hand for hire" of some other Will.
Then there is the question about accepting money for spiritual advice .. Over time, I could perhaps set myself up as a guru of some sort, but I think it would be a bad mistake to do this "for a living" ..
Sorry for the long post and scattered questions..
I guess what it boils down to is this:
I am feeling so free, so lucky to be able to structure my days and my work myself .. I feel like something is beginning to pouring out from inside, rather than me just reacting to forces shaping my existence from the outside ..
I dread the prospect of taking a step back again this autumn, and I am desperately looking for a way to take control over my life, to be the source of the happening, rather than the receiver. I imagine - if I could find out the Truth about my existence, I would be able to take the step up and remain in this mode of life, even in the face of the necessity of earning money ..As always, any advice is highly appreciated.
Love is the law, love under will,
Frater Katanoese@Los said
"
@Bereshith said
"Yes, precisely, and the above argument demonstrates that the same is true for both kinds of experiences. "It doesn't demonstrate anything of the kind. You're just baldly asserting that the "experience" of ritual can enable a person to discover the True Will.
Someone could just as easily argue that taking out the garbage is an experience that has no explanatory power. Discovering the True Will requires experiences, which have no explanatory power. Discovering the True Will requires taking out the garbage, which has no explanatory power.
It's nonsense. You can say it, but that doesn't make it correct."
You are currently demonstrating an inability to follow logic.
Please review the argument.
Please state the specific Given, Premise, or Conclusion you would like to dispute.
I believe you missed a step here:
@Bereshith said
"Given: Knowledge is appropriately pursued through the means required to gain it.
Premise: Knowledge is appropriately pursued through the means required to gain it.
Premise: Gaining knowledge of one's True Will requires experiences, which have no explanatory power.
Conclusion: Gaining knowledge of one's True Will is appropriately pursued through the means of experiences, which have no explanatory power.
Premise: Gaining knowledge of one's True Will is appropriately pursued through the means of experiences, which have no explanatory power.
Premise: Meditation and ritual both yield experiences, which have no explanatory power.
Conclusion: Gaining knowledge of one's True Will is appropriately pursued through the experiences yielded by both meditation and ritual even though these experiences have no explanatory power."
