Evocation of Choronzon in the lower grades
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I was wondering, what could happen theorically if a neophyte or a zelator evoqued Choronzon with the intention of crossing the abyss?
Could it act as a catalyser to step to the next grade, as it would permit to cross the current grade's "abyss"?
Or could it work properly? Or be very dangerous? Or do nothing? What else? What do you think?
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@Horus Amin said
"I was wondering, what could happen theorically if a neophyte or a zelator evoqued Choronzon with the intention of crossing the abyss?"
A disaster.
"Could it act as a catalyser to step to the next grade, as it would permit to cross the current grade's "abyss"?"
Hell no.
"Or could it work properly? Or be very dangerous? Or do nothing? What else? What do you think?"
The second thing probably, with a possibility of the third thing.
PS: It's an Adeptus Exemptus (Major) who crosses the Abyss.
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"the all is in all and all is in the all" hermes...
I might stretch this a little too much?
But, at the same time, isn't a form of Choronzon in every tree of life? I mean, in the tree of every sephirah?
If not, how do we refer to what i mean? The crossing of duality on each particular sephirah and plane.
Is Choronzon strictly and only the ordeal between briah and atziluth?
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I believe it's just that Choronzon needs to be defeated utterly before one can reach the supernals. But mental dispersion is a challenge at any stage.
For example, see a few of the recent threads on this forum. Never ending, unproductive, circular logic...
Sent from my phone
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@Horus Amin said
"But, at the same time, isn't a form of Choronzon in every tree of life? I mean, in the tree of every sephirah?"
I don't know.
"If not, how do we refer to what i mean? The crossing of duality on each particular sephirah and plane."
Not need for Choronzon at all! We have the Paths for that. Bringing Choronzon in would only be dangerous and confusing.
"Is Choronzon strictly and only the ordeal between briah and atziluth?"
AFAIK yes.
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What would happen?
Well, most likely nothing - because you wouldn't likely have the capacity the succeed.
Or, if you had the cavity to succeed, then the likely result is obsession or insanity.
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I will share an experience related to this for the sake of science, even if i sound crazy again... I would not recommend to anyone trying this. I would even say "please dont do it" actually. I'm not joking. But honestly i dont think we decide such stuff. Some stuff are just meant to happen.
A little more than a year ago, when i was having the most trouble with path of tav, and thought i was becoming a "great adept"(lol...), i just did what i'm asking about here. I evoqued 333.
I think my HGA prevented me from doing it properly(from a technical aspect)... yet, things happened. I felt a very special presence that i had never experienced before, and it was hardcore. I remember it like it was yesterday... Very agressive, and physical(compared to what experienced before, except one particular being which had clear physical manifestation, the only one i ever achieved actually). I could feel the texture of air changing in the room, and it was loaded with a kind of electricity. This happened while evoquing other beings before, but this one was a very different feeling. Less flashy but more deep. More omnipresent, less concentrated, dont know how to phrase it better. Also, there was like a green light, smoke, and feeling(cant describe it better). It just felt wrong and weird.
But in my madness, i just kept on staying with it for hours, trying to "cross the abyss".That actually felt similar to what Crowley describes, except it was way softer. After that, i felt disoriented, sick, and depressed for a couple of weeks. I could not concentrate, nor talk to anyone. I just stayed at home waiting to feel better, and then avoided any magick for a couple of months.
Now, looking back at it, i really dont know what to think. It certainly was a negative experience overall, but it might have help me destructure my old personality. When i undertook magick again, i felt it was less "me" working, and more the magick "working by itself". Also, most of my opinions, aspirations, bias, and personality stuff felt like impersonal. I felt it was just this way because it happened to be this way... nothing more. This in itself was disorienting and depressing. Because it was abrupt and i was certainly not ready.
In psychoanalysis, we say that when there is a trauma, it is good to wait some time before analysing it. Let the wound heal and veil itself before dealing with it and opening it again...
Now i think it's ok(damn, it took time), and it would be cool to understand what actually happened. I dont think it helped me with the neophyte stuff i was supposed to work on. But maybe it helped me equilibrate myself, as i had a big ego. Especially at that time, when i was deluded into thinking i was a "great adept". So what happened might have been triggered by my own ego? Or phrasing it differently, the owergrowth of the ego triggered its own (partial) destruction by natural reaction? Could it be the HGA who at the same time, triggered this, and prevented it from going too far? Do you see anything to learn from that except i did a dumb thing?
That's the first time i share this, i felt too ashamed before.
It feels cathartic...By the way, what about the "green light, smoke, and feeling"? Has green something to do with Choronzon? Or might it come from my own reaction to the experience? What does this suggest to you?
Also, could it be an other being who took the place of Choronzon, deluding me it was Choronzon i evoqued?! How could i test such thing?
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The best the yearling student can hope to accomplish with such an evocation is the adoption of a petty, argumentative attitude that manifests itself in grammatically inept diatribes rife with reasoned egotism.
"For example, see a few of the recent threads on this forum. Never ending, unproductive, circular logic..."
Quite.
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Yet again, you and I have something in common, but I invoked the f*cker!
I thought myself strong enough to stare it in the eye and swallow it whole.Overall, my experiences are exactly the same(again, not even gonna list 'em).
I very much know the presence you describe, the "physical" and "aggressive" nature of it(my thoughts became physical sensations, and they felt like battery acid). It took over my life for somewhere around two months. I had to take cold showers almost everyday due to my body overheating constantly under the stress, and repeat the mantra "Babalon, be as water to this heat" to calm myself for sleep and orient myself up and out of the hell I manifested. I took up smoking cigarettes during this time
something I had always disdained.It was a dreadfully stupid thing to do, I would NOT recommend it anywhere, yet I did learn. It was either that or shrivel entirely. Popped my ego like a balloon! Madness madness. My "logic" behind it was that seeing myself experience total disordering of the senses and self would reveal to me the ultimate mechanism behind both and place it at my disposal. What's sanity mean to anyone if they've never known madness? Yeah. I was young, freshly turned 18. I got my adolescent humbling.
I'm still young, still getting order back and healing that wound. A certain friend of mine, a real Adept, said some things to me that turned me right the f*ck around. My biggest fear was that I was a "done deal" after that, a broken toy no longer capable of true communion, but time and raw will has shown that this can't happen so early on. A tough path for one to take, but tough love after all.
Where best to start anything but at the bottom?...
(for the record, I am now Working as a Probationer)