College of Thelema: Thelemic Education

There's also the not so well known Ibn 'Arabi.

@Jim Eshelman said

"
As Soror Meral said on more than one occasion: "Emotions! That's not a one of them worth anything at all. (Except love.)" And, as I mentioned previously, I think it best not to classify love as an emotion because it has so little in common with any of the others: it most resembles inspiration."

But now obviously Love in this sense has a lower "emotional" manifestation a well. The one time I actually engaged very deeply into depression and victimhood to the point of experiencing what Ramsey Dukes (Lionel Snell) calls a "polarity flip", I experienced immediiately thereafter, an epiphany where all the Sufi poetry about being in love with the world (like Rumi's work) made complete cognitive sense. It was a though I felt I should consume / be consumed by the World in an act of Love (and of course, how Thelemic!) Just prior to this I actually felt an energy shift in the chakras from the Svādhiṣṭhāna to the Viśuddha.

This is what confuses me. As you said Jim, by moving things around on a lower plane it does not mean we attain a higher plane and yet for the first time in years, energy started moving and I experienced "breakthroughs". Of course the epiphany was sadly rather short lived. This is what confuses me, on a practical level I did seem to attain something "higher", but it seems contrary to typical RHP methods and there is the danger of being "lost in illusion" if one does not achieve that polarity flip and I suppose in some extreme cases being driven to acts of madness like suicide etc. My leaning right now, is that it could potentially be a valid technique but really needs to be balanced with a lot of RHP work too. On the other hand, perhaps I just experienced some lower yesodic form of self-love (which I guess could become dangerous), although I'd have to say it was not a selfish (nor selfless) Love but rather a kind of Joy towards the experience of life.

Jim, should we then approach this with the attitude that if Yesod cannot produce entry into Tipharet, at least our work on this level is to continually practice adjustment so that Yesod might progressively become an appropriate vehicle for the true will at some future time?

@Jim Eshelman said

"
You had the wrong therapist. (Probably a bad one, at that.)"

Well the one I have now who's a kind of Jungian occultists (very into his shamanism), who been running a course for about 30 years based on the old 60's EST training (which we've chatted about before) actually proposed the animistic technique of dialogging with my "neuroses" (emotions) as though they were spirits...and that has led me to this point! Of course that is why I purchased Ramsey Dukes' book "The little book of demons: the positive advantages of personifying life's problems".

@Jim Eshelman said

"
There are common misunderstandings about N.O.X. Here you seem to equate it to "shadow," that is, to aspects of subconsciousness. That's not what it is at all. N.O.X. isn't infernal, isn't subconsciousness; it's supernal, it's superconsciousness. It's the darkness of the depths of space after leaving the earth's atmosphere, not the darkness of tunnelling underground. It's the darkness that comes from a saturation of LIGHT to overwhelming that our faculties can't register it yet, not the darkness that comes from an absence of light."

Thank you for the clarification. I get it, but I obviously don't understand it yet.

@Jim Eshelman said

"Some things that might help:

A large percentage of people think that their reactive emotions are "authentic," and that they must, therefore, give full vent and expression to them to be genuine and whole. I completely agree that you have to give full expression to all genuine strong aspects of yourself in order to be whole; but these reactive emotions are a fiction; that is, they're a part of the machinery of your mortal, human psyche that are innately transient in the first place and, secondly, don't have any real connection to what is most real in you. Furthermore, they aren't authentic. They may certainly be "justified" (and oh, how we like to justify them!), but they usually are a defense against what's real."

Jim, thanks for your insights.

I tend to think of the so-called "lower emotions" as a "malformation" of true will or love in the sense that they exist simply because we are not experiencing or doing love and/or will properly.

To cite an example, in my own self-analysis, I've realized that depression for example generally stems from a dissatisfaction with the way life is going ie: it's there to tell you something, that you're bloody well not satisfied with the way things are! Now, at the core of this emotion, if we dig deep enough I find self-love (or self-respect) for why would we be depressed in the first place if hidden behind that depression was not the desire to be fulfilled in the first place? Conversely mania as a kind of polar opposite of depression hides the exact same principle, it's aggressive "active form" of trying to find satisfaction, fulfillment etc.

I think of this as a kind of "alchemical distillation" of the polar opposites of emotions into their pure archetype, but I'm not sure if my thinking is actually correct on the matter. I know from practical experience that by really exploring these emotions, depression for example, going into it well below the surface one can experience a "polarity flip" which indicates one has found the "source" (and then must be careful to not move too drastically into other pole either). I remember Dion fortune saying somewhere that pathworking can be achieved simply by "living life", dealing with day-to-day situations as they arise and our responses to them and I've always thought of life itself as an alchemical process.

However a good friend whom I respect also said that no sage has ever suggested that Yesodic work will actually "produce" or lead into Tipharet. Levi said "don't listen to the voices" and yes I realize they are deceptive on the surface, but I'm partly convinced (and Lightening strike down the Tree would support this) that by exploring them deeply until one experiences a polarity flip that one touches their archetypal source in Tipharet or something like that.

I suppose it is difficult for a neophyte or an ordinary man to even understand what Tipheret means and I suppose that in the meantime our emotional experiences are the only way we can relate to what it might be. I've personally found value in this kind of "self-therapy" and of course another useful technique is to recognize the polar opposite of what one is feeling ie: sadness hides potential joy and vice versa (the buddhist "attachment") etc etc....as Crowley says I think in Liber Aleph: "seek to balance every force with it opposite" (paraphrased)...and to use the opposite idea to figure out the the archetpyal source of the feelings we're having.

Personally in terms of therapy I really got very little out of it in the past. My therapist actually told me to stop all spiritual practices, which set me back 15 years, and now I have to deal with the exact same issue once again. There was always this idea that I was "broken" and that one day my therapist would miraculously find some past incident that was a source of my "panic attacks" and all would magically dissolve in that moment. Being more pragmatic these days, if I'm feeling anxiety right now then it's telling me something that I need to look at and there's no more of a magic bullet hidden in some historical event as there's a way of dealing with it right now and in the moment. However, CBT does seem to work very well for people and some people just seem to have such positive outlooks towards life. I suppose some part of me believes that my life in the last couple of years has taken me deeply into shadow work and beginning anew on a magickal path (L.U.X based work) almost feels like taking several steps backward, although the invocation of L.U.X is probably exactly what is required to deal with the shadow. Perhaps it's just the recommendations that one is not to dabble with N.O.X prematurely that makes me think this?

Apologies for going so deeply into personal issues, but I think it has theoretical application and hopefully others will find value in this discussion too. Am I making sense with what I'm saying or am I totally off track here?

@Jim Eshelman said

"There are all sorts of tricks one can learn - a good therapist, working with you weekly for 6 to 12 months, should be able to teach you these. Some of them, for example, have to do with increasing your truth sense about what is authentic to you."

I get the feeling you're warning me to be careful of taking subjective "psychic" experiences too seriously to avoid psychosis. The way I see it is that I'm not really all that psychic, I generally only "see" things when I'm in a mild trance state (often while on the border of sleep) or late at night in a very mild form when tiredness seems to slowly erode the natural barriers between the conscious and subconscious. It can be a little unsettling of course to perceive things and to hear things talking to you, sometimes with pretty nasty, self-destructive or confusing messages, but your advice is well taken. Thank you. Perhaps there is a good reason to compliment these experiences by following them with cold, critical analysis.

Couldn't get beyond I:6 without giggling. It's fantastic to be able to laugh at one's own religion! And yet there seem to be hidden truths in all the humor!

Thanks so much to those who contributed to this.

Couldn't get beyond I:6 without giggling. It's fantastic to be able to laugh at one's own religion! And yet there seem to be hidden truths in all the humor!

Thanks so much to those who contributed to this.

@Jim Eshelman said

"The less important (but still important) half of my view: Aside from that general equilibration, any monkeying with the Q'lippoth is likely a masturbatory toying around below late 5=6 or even 6=5. When eventually tethered to the inmost center of one's being, one can (and, actually, must) hurl oneself into all corners of the unconscious. Until then, only the very rarest of people would have a psycho-spiritual bungee that could do the job."

Jim, just a quick question relating to this, if I may.

I have found that daily LBRP exacerbates "suppression". While this is positive in the sense that the day-to-day conscious mind starts to get along well without it's neuroses, the negative spin-off is that these neuroses are not dealt with and can "haunt" one psychically, so to speak, or alternatively "haunt" one during certain sleep states, where one wakes with blood shot eyes and feeling "gut wrenched". Is the idea to "push through" with LBRP practice long enough in the hopes that these get buried far enough to not be a "haunting annoyance" (until one reaches 5=6 and begins to work with them proactively) or if they manifest in this particularly disturbing way might it be indicative of having to deal with some neurosis at an earlier stage?

@Frater Sabaechi said

"Well for me personally the whole concept of Gods is man-made. They are just our attempt to describe the ineffable.
"

I'd tend to agree, provided that it is understood that the gods are subconscious / unconscious / intuitive constructs rather than intellectual ones. The popular "atheist" myth going around that the gods were initially intellectual constructs thought up to solve philosophical problems is complete rubbish. The most primitive peoples who don't care a hell for explaining how a tree or a mountain got where it was, have their gods, and all those gods are very accurate "descriptors" of the intuitive relationship they have with their environment (and themselves).

EDIT: Oops, never noticed that I replied to a post that's more than a year old.

@Jim Eshelman said

"
@modernPrimitive said
"Could you perhaps give a practical example of what you mean by "conquering"."

Could you give an example of a real-life example that needs conquering?"

How about the example I mentioned? The tendency to self-sabotage so that one can perpetuate the pattern of "beating oneself up".

"There is always a shadow aspect to a passionately sought goal. (Always!) Were there not, then one would already have the result: One’s will to its manifestation, in the absence of internal resistance, would already have prevailed.

Therefore, one must discover and explore all counter intentions within oneself. Often the best way of finding these is to ask oneself what payoff, reward, or advantage one might have from failing in the operation.

Most people, more often than being afraid of failure, are afraid of success. Success can totally disrupt one’s negative view of self and the universe! Success in a major goal often requires that we sacrifice anger, resentment, the myth of helplessness, and blameful views. Getting what you really want wrecks havoc with your excuses, and may require that you finally get on with life. Success calls for increased accountability to oneself, others, and the universe.

For some, this may seem too high a price to pay. One must get past this barrier if one expects to succeed as a magician.

Other interior barriers that often must be examined and confronted include feelings of unworthiness, guild, and doubt; an impulse to self-punishment or self-harm; and any number of other unconscious needs to fail in the operation.

Find these; know these; and conquer these as a final act of purification of oneself in preparation for the sacred operation you plan to undertake."

Jim, thanks for this, with which I can completely identify. "Finding" and "knowing" is not the difficult task and I imagine that your statement above applies to pretty much the whole of humanity, the question is how to conquer it!

From personal experience it seem that one can suppress these "shadows" for a certain amount of time but as Jung said "If you don't let it in the front door it will come through the back door" and hence long-term failure seems assured. He suggests "integration" which I have understood to mean taking conscious control of the problem. For example, let's say that I have discovered that self-sabotage is a means for me to perpetuate the patterns of "beating myself up". Do I consciously decide to "beat myself up" every Sunday so that for the rest of the week I can remain free of the problem and achieve my goals? Of course now that I've taken my dose 'consciously' the idea is that it will not bite me in the ass. But this method seems to merely be the conscious perpetuation of a negative pattern.

However it's as though this self-beating serves a purpose, that I might need to beat myself up occasionally so that I might actually achieve something rather than fall into complacency which might simply produce an aimless existence, that I might inspire movement rather than stasis. Of course, it's not particularly pleasant and it feels as though this is a far cry from "conquering" so to speak, yet in a way, I feel that I'm harnessing a "negative" for a "positive" outcome, and in that way that I'm in the driving seat rather than the Shadow. This is difficult and painful work and I'm not sure if I'm on the right track achieving only a modicum of successes.

Could you perhaps give a practical example of what you mean by "conquering".

I've been invited to join the Grand Lodge of England. Considering limitations on time and the fact that I'm already a member of a Thelemic fraternity (OTO), is it advisable to join? I'm just not sure that spending hours memorizing texts and going out for drinks on a Friday night is time well spent in terms a return on investment. I'd rather spend the time on magickal training...or am I underestimating the "magick" in Masonry?

@Tarotica said

"So, very few people ever articulate that, or that it might be a problem, especially given Lon's role as a public spokesperson for Thelema.

Someone posted the following to my blog today, complaining about the fact I had attacked the beloved "savior":

"Duquette's a nice fellow whose half-dozen well-researched, useful, and straightforward books about Thelema have played a great part in saving the religion from the dustbin of history..."

I think that is a popular view of Lon's contribution. And few people question it."

Well I'd have to say that Lon is a "balancing force" in terms of Crowley's work. Crowley seemed to assume that everyone had a classical education, including degrees in philosophy, a degree in Egyptology, could read and write in several ancient languages etc. How far removed are we today in this more modern era from that kind of education?

People like Lon are needed to make Crowley's work more accessible. I say Crowley's work, because I think Thelema, in term of the HBT is by default "accessible", the support structures that Crowley wrote are not that accessible. It's like if you've never studied physics before and try and jump into loop quantum gravity or the Holographic Principle and Black hole Entropy you're going to struggle. Read a "physics for idiots" book first.

@modernPrimitive said

"I also think that what was written is as much indicative of an unbalanced mind (especially in terms of language use) as it might contain some kind of "valuable insight"."

@Tarotica said

"
@modernPrimitive said
"I'm not sure I agree with the Satanism bit. This to me, is all really just a matter of semantics."

That is not a minor matter, especially in the occult."

hmmm....yes and no. I think an "object" can have many names. Gematria and Notorikon aside, what is more important is the concept or archetype behind the idea than the actual name itself. Given that you're addressing an audience that is most probably under the control of the demon of fear created and perpetuated by organized Christianity, you likely need an old jolly Santa Claus type character to treat the subject light-heartedly and with a touch of humour.

@Tarotica said

"Thelemites may not like being associated with Satan or Satanism, but they have their prophet to complain to if they have a problem about that.

Crowley was not vague or ambiguous about worshipping Satan or being his servant or even offspring.

If a person, such as Crowley, means by "I am a Satanist", that he is really a baker, or a postal employee, then he probably needs to learn a better appreciation for the semantics of the terms he uses.

But I am sure he well understood that. And chose his words carefully, and righteously."

Edward hit the nail on the head.

@Tarotica said

"And a lot of other religions and systems, which he sometimes admired, as he did Islam. But Crowley was not a Muslim.

He was a Satanist.

(jk)"

Religious experimentation aside, Crowley was a Thelemite. If you really want to be technical about it, the only real Biblical story containing any definitive content about Satan is the Book of Job, and in that story Satan is simply portrayed as "an accuser", much like a court lawyer. Another detailed mention of who and what Satan is, is to be found in one of the books of Enoch, where it is said that like Lucifer, he fell from heaven and circles the Abyss. In this sense we have a correlation of Satan with Choronzon. Most other lay attributions of Satan seem to be conflations with the Devil or Lucifer, the latter most probably being a conflation based on that particular book of Enoch, simply because, like Lucifer, Satan "fell from Heaven". We also have Leviathan, and the conflations keep growing from that point onward, probably because people are too terrified to explore these ideas. I'm not sure Crowley was overtly academic about this....in fact I think he used the term Satan as it was defined and already conflated by the Christians.

Of course, we can conclude that Hadit has many things in common with Satan or the Devil or Lucifer. But then we can find commonality between Lucifer and Venus, or the Devil, Pan and Baphomet or even Lucifer and Christ (A god made manifest sounds very much like a fallen-star). If you want to conflate all of these ideas then it is probably wise to take that kind of Qabalistic exercise to the point where one can only surmise that all is one (or none).

"Let there be no difference made among you between any one thing & any other thing; for thereby there cometh hurt."..."Every number is infinite; there is no difference." - Liber AL.

That was a strange article.

In some odd way I can sort of agree with some of the things said by the author, even though I kinda like old Lon, Santa Claus persona and all. Yes, Lon doesn't exactly ooze the persona of a 'serious occultist'. But, so what? I also think that what was written is as much indicative of an unbalanced mind (especially in terms of language use) as it might contain some kind of "valuable insight". I'm not sure I agree with the Satanism bit. This to me, is all really just a matter of semantics. Call it what you will, give it any name you desire, it is what it is. I'd also say that Crowley's "Satanism" is a far cry from LaVey's type of Satanism.

Crowley also spent several years studying Sufism and esoteric Islam. Are we to say he was a Muslim? Should we all pray to Allah now? Again, just semantics. Thelema stands on it's own and doesn't need to be conflated with Old Aeonic ideas.

Just my opinion, as the author is welcome to his own.

@Uni_Verse said

"Of course, this might just be an ordeal of my own. I am the kind of person who will suffer through much abuse in order to protect the feelings of another - even a total stranger."

Well, I would hesitate to give advice to a fellow Thelemite who has the tools to undo their own complexes but I have seen this very pattern time and time again in society. Indeed it's very close to my own personal situation - it' a kind of "yes man" or "nice guy" archetype and to me reminiscent of the Osirian Aeon, in that there's a tendency to sacrifice the self for the supposed "greater good".

Personally, I see how my childhood "programming" resulted in this kind of complex and it lead me to issues with self-expression. The anger outbursts were directed towards those people in my life who had established a kind of "master-slave" relationship with me based on that particular complex, even though they were not at fault for it's origins so to speak....I try to remove any blame from the picture, for it is I that allowed it to take root in the first place, even if I was only mere toddler.

In terms of depth psychology, several psychologists have proposed that the king archetype has two shadow aspects...those being the "weakling prince" and the "tyrant". To me, these shadow aspects contain one another, in that an outward tyrant contains a weakling prince internally and the outward weakling prince contains an "inner tyrant". They are what they are because they rely on one another as opposite poles of outward behavior vs inner feeling. The work for me has been to establish a relationship with both of these shadow aspects, empathize with them and come to understand that they are malformations of the True King, who exudes his inner confidence but does not need to be cruel to do so.

Continual banishing and alchemical work of course draws me a lot closer to being a "wholesome King" and I no longer need to have angry outbursts due to inner feelings of inferiority. People need to respect my point of view....and it's not necessarily about being "right" as it is simply that each individual's point of view must be respected. The King is often "wrong" and that's the role of the court Jester, to point that out. I no longer suffer from "angry outbursts", however I'm quite capable of expressing such if someone is trying to control or manipulate me....sometimes I still fall into those shadows from time to time in more extreme cases...and the work continues!

Just wanted to say that you're not alone Apophis. Iv'e experienced a very similar thing. Initial practices tended to bring up old emotional issues that I had suppressed. I never managed to get past about 10 days of continued practice without feeling like I was becoming a neurotic wreck and a complete asshole to the people around me. This happened several times in the past and resulted in me stopping daily LBRP practice.

However, more recently, continued practice actually managed to "break through" those issues.....I could actually feel some subconscious energy being "loosened" during a particular LBRP. This actually "broke" a depression I was in. If that wasn't strange enough, 10 minutes after that particular ritual, just as I finished my diary entry, some pretty crazy psychological issues arose with the people around me.

My guess is that people you're in a relationships with might notice the changes in you, either consciously or unconsciously, and they might struggle a bit in dealing with those changes. As Jim pointed out, be aware of over-reacting, but keep at it, meditation and LBRP. Of course I should probably also mention that I was using a technique of dealing with the emotional "mud stirring" which I believed helped me through it. It's basically a kind of self-therapy, an animistic idea where one objectifies and talks to one's "issues", as though they are "spirits" or "demons", along the lines of Jung's "active imagination" technique. Of course this is just a gentler form of proper Goetic work. If you're interested in this technique, get a copy of "Uncle Ramsey's little book of demons: The positive advantage of personifying life's problems". I can't recommend it enough. A few days of this technique did more for me than 15 years of struggling through some of my problems.

@Limb said

"The same night I had an intense encounter with him in a dream. He was all light, but he looked like himself during what I believe to be his best years. "

That is interesting. My wife had many dreams around this time and she said the same thing....my father was always a good 15-20 years younger in the dreams (and she didn't even know him at that age, she had merely seen photographs.) In the few dreams that I remembered he was also a lot younger. (Most of my "psychic encounters" lacked a specific and detailed visual component.)

Oh yes, even my mother-in-law dreamed about him and she he also looked younger. In fact she had commented in the dream how fantastic he looked and he replied with something along the lines of how wonderful he felt and that they should consider joining him! LOL!

WOW! Alias, this sounds very familiar.

About 15 years ago I joined AMORC (but was complimenting their system with LBRP and MP) and I developed a rather hectic anxiety disorder. My psychologist at the time told me to stay away from spiritual practices, which is probably the worst thing I did! I wasted about 14 years as an armchair philosopher.

My recent work however has brought back a whole host of emotions, including anxiety. I've recently had problems with a spastic colon and went onto some medication for it. However, what has been working for me was the old animistic technique of "talking to your issues" as though they are independent spirits. I don't use the whole ceremonial method but rather a simple Jungian "active imagination" technique and of course I then compliment it with LBRP. When anxiety comes up I objectify it, and have a little chat...empathize with it etc. My first experiment was with my spastic colon, I drew it, gave it a name and during a deep relaxed state engaged in conversation.

Ramsey Dukes suggests this technique in "Uncle Ramsay's little book of demons: the positive advantage of personifying life's problems", although he doesn't mention the specific technique's for making contact. It could be in a simple "active imagination" way or a full goetic style working with triangle and all. I'm not set up for the latter yet. I brought this up in another thread about "bargaining versus binding" and he suggests that if one values achievement over success one must play "tough love" with one's "demons" whereas if one values happiness over achievement one might try empathy with them instead. Indeed, in my own experiments I've managed to get what he calls a "polarity flip" when I empathized deeply enough with my depression (which was related to my spastic colon). I'd highly recommend his book as a theoretical observation of the strategies involved in dealing with life's problems (demons).

The reason I mention this is because during a "breakthrough polarity-flip" dialogue, while I was in a relaxed state I actually experienced energy movement from the Svadisthana up to the heart and throat centers! Something I never expected at all! This has opened up a whole new area of work for me. It's the most progress I've made with my depression, anxiety and health issues ever. My spastic colon is no longer particularly spastic and I'm off the medication as well. People have been telling me for years that I have too much pent up energy in my Svadisthana. Something else that has helped me, has been learning to be "okay" with not feeling "okay", emotional resilience I guess....doing the work, the ordeals etc, knowing that this is just a process I'm going through. Before this I kept thinking "why am I broken?" and tried suppression over empathy.

Anyway, I just thought I'd mention what I've been doing and the results I'm getting out of it. Lionel Snell (Ramsay Dukes) performed the Abramelin Operation in 1977, so he has years of wisdom to impart regarding the long-term results of how we deal with our "demons". All I can say is that this "intuitive" approach has been far more successful than trying to intellectualize these problems. A few weeks ago the doctors were convinced I had a duodenal ulcer so I drew it, asked it for a name and began dialogue. After a few minutes, I intuited that I don't have an ulcer at all but rather a spastic colon that was bloating and causing my stomach to herniate through my diaphragm (a hiatus hernia). Two days later, a gastroscopy of my stomach and a sonar of my intestine confirmed my intuition. Your body can tell you what's up with it. Of course be aware that you may be led down a road of slight confusion. In my experience, one has to empathize with one's "personal demons", but know that they kind of represent a malformed shadow aspect of an archetype. If you can get to that point of "polarity flip" through empathy then you touch on that pure archetype. Be careful then to not go too far into the other pole (for example self-hatred can polarity flip into narcissism) but maintain a balance. It seems like a juggling act.

I'm not too experienced with this yet, so take it from where it comes. Best of luck!

PS: As I go deeper into this I realize the need for a full Goetic style working. The 'Active imagination' technique is fine for the little things but when you start working with serious aggression for example you want it to be "objective".

93 93/93

Thanks Edward,

By some strange "miracle" my own father's belief system seemed to have rescued him from some kinds of torment. When he first appeared to me, very childlike and quite unlike his normal "kingly" self (He was a King in life, albeit of the Niezschean type) there was an angel beside him and this angel strangely enough took the form of one of those old Catholic paintings, quite unlike the Hollywood way in which I personally visualize angels.

Anyway, that aside, you're quite right about opening psychic doorways. On one occasion when it felt like he had come to tell me something, after I opened myself to it, within a few seconds I had a young little boy and communicating to me as well as a middle-aged man, both with "urgent messages". I got a bit of a fright and decided that I sure as hell didn't want to go there so "chased them all away" and closed up immediately. It was as though I'd opened up some "portal". I remembered Crowley's mention of the auras of spiritualists!

I lost my father about 2 years ago and I had some rather interesting and emotional psychic experiences. I know this is not exactly on topic, but I was wondering if others have had the same and what they think of these experiences.

Personally I used to be kind of skeptical of perceiving the deceased psychically but there were some indicators that some of the details did not originate from "my own mind" so to speak. I don't want to go into too much detail but it's the kind of argument Crowley uses for asserting that Aiwass could not have originated within his own mind...let's say certain elements were "foreign" and unexpected although if I'm brutally analytical about it I would have to say it's not impossible these did not originate in my own mind.

One of these was a sort of intuitive feeling that my father was saying goodbye...that he could no longer "visit" as he was moving on to some other plane or something. I later read in The Tibetan Book of Living and Dying (The modern adapted work based on the original medieval work) about the 49 day period after which the "soul" moves into another bardo, and this timeframe was very precise. Another unexpected element was that it was as though his "persona" had been dropped, and I experienced a side of him that was quite unlike his day-to-day self...of course it still correlated with aspects of his personality, but those that one rarely sees.

At other times I think that some of those experiences where just a part of the grieving process.

Just wondering if others have had similar experiences and whether they correlate with my own observations.

Jim, thanks for your feedback again. I've been toying with the idea a bit and Fire on the right correlating with Geburah seems more intuitive for me.

@gmugmble said

"
@Jim Eshelman said
"If that's a neurological basis for the distribution of the Elements, then it affects a very great deal."

Some people have the hemispheres reversed, with the "right brain" functions on the left and the "left brain" functions on the right. That complicates the issue. (And unfortunately it doesn't correlate with anything simple like handedness.)"

Lol. Yes, we would have to design 4 sets of rituals to cater for hemispheres as well as the left-handed folks. And what if you're ambidextrous!?