College of Thelema: Thelemic Education

@spaceman said

"WOW! Tamara....WOW! Thanks so much, this is great.

Man that Khephra man with the beetle head is CREEEEEEEPY!

But SO AWESOME!!! "

Yeah. The last one reminds me of a venomous head crab!

@danica said

"
@Seraph said
".... There's one called "Love poems" or "Love Poetry", something like that (I don't have it on hand) and I think it's a nicely focused collection. "

www.4shared.com/document/y84kcEZB/24981522-Rumi-The-Book-of-Love.htm"

Exactly the one, thank you!

@Solitarius said

"You've sold it to me.
Can you perhaps provide me with a short reading list? I'm not familiar with sufi philosophy and don't really know where to start."

Idries Shah wrote "The Sufis", though I'd start with the poetry of Rumi. You can Google lots of it, or Ebay & Amazon have loads of books by him if you prefer, and they're ALL good. There's one called "Love poems" or "Love Poetry", something like that (I don't have it on hand) and I think it's a nicely focused collection. The wonderful thing about the Sufis is that the soul of that Beauty (I'm inclined to substitute the word "Tipareth") is all you need to learn about them!

I think I have a PDF of Shah's book round here somewhere if you'd like.

@Andrey said

"To be fair, I agree with Froclown, everything he has said makes perfect sense, and does not require the bending of modern science to suit personal theories about the world. It is also a healthy position, if we were to believe others without scrutinizing and weighing evidence, and checking on methods we would easily be mislead. A god of the gaps argument, like the ones made from the complexity of quantum mechanics, and loss of body weight, are essentially saying look- here is something that we currently do not understand, therefore it proves my world view. I can only imagine how many such arguments were made for rainbows before we understood refraction.

To be more fair yet again, this skeptical position, is the perfect starting point for exploring the occult, personally once I get projection down to a controllable ability, I intend to do experiments on it, to verify one way or another where it is a construct of the brain, or something more objective than that. So I respect the opinions of many people here who may have verified from experiment such things for themselves, but your personal verifications cannot ever be proof to another person.

(Ninja edit: I love this forums stance on sexism in general and in the occult, its nice to see such a healthy stance given Crowley views)"

Kind of. Ish.

The point I'm making is that something animates us from mere atoms. Something makes us greater in power than an amoeba. Something within nearly all of us says it would be wrong of me to kill or rape someone's mother. All those things remain constant, regardless of our Aeon.

I would point at that thing (I care not what you wish to call it ~ it has many names), utterly undefinable and unexplainable by science, and say "This is a soul. It is important."

@Froclown said

"Atoms are the basic building blocks of EVERYTHING, in fact atoms are the only things than exist because EVERYTHING is made of atoms, there is nothing else out from which to build anything.

YOU and all humans are THINGS that exist in the universe, THUS You are Atoms and nothing else.

There is no need to postulate that anything that is not included in EVERYTHING that exists in the universe, is necessary to human life. Thus a human is a thing in the universe made out of Atoms, ie physical matter, ie the ONLY ontological substance which exists ANYWHERE.

QED"

I can show you atoms, too. A few kilos of carbon, about 8 pints of water, iron, calcium, sulphur, sodium chloride, zinc, complex hydrocarbons, and smaller piles of other stuff too.

Is it a human being?

@JPF said

"From what I hear, Rumi had a rather extensive harem. "

Little is made of how Rumi lived his life, but he was wealthy, and had at least one son, so it's not beyond what would have been expected of him as a 13th Century scholar. I didn't know that.

A quote that I'm always reminded of is that Sufis are not in any way against owning things, but they are totally set against being owned by things.

@JPF said

"Or perhaps the good Froclown was providing a much needed counterpoint to this "flaccid" discussion."

The point is "Love" and it's representation on a mortal plane for many of us (I'm just saying most men are heterosexual), and how misogyny is supposed to represent some sort of counterpoint. Whether it be the actual case or not, that was the language of rejection and loss; someone who has suffered for the love of a women enough to forcibly objectify and categorise all women without thought. That's such an old Aeon concept, I think. It's so ardently angry, anti-Nuit, anti-Universe, I'm surprised that anyone could find it hard to see how anti-Self the attitude ultimately is.

Forget Will, until you find out what that is, some point in the future ("shall be"), **Love **is the Law, right here, right now.

"The Guesthouse
This being human is a guesthouse
Every morning a new arrival
A joy, a depression, a meanness
Some momentary awareness
Comes as an unexpected visitor

Welcome and entertain them all!
Even if they're a crowd of sorrows
Who violently sweep your house
Empty of its furniture
Still treat each guest honorably
He may be cleaning you out
For some new delight!

The dark thought, the shame, the malice
Meet them at the door laughing
And invite them in
Be grateful for whoever comes
Because each has been sent
As a guide from the beyond
~ Rumi (Translated by Coleman Barks)"

Now tell me it's a good idea to hold on so tightly to hurt and anger!

@Solitarius said

"I've not read him, I'll give it a look if I can remember the name.
I have to admit I really like the Muslim world view when you divorce it from Religious dogma, they have a very earthy take on things."

Oh absolutely, it's the Sufis that truly are sublime IMO; I see it as simply a synonym - they are merely other words for the same thing. Hearing an eloquent dervish waxing poetic about the ocean of divine love is something else; substitute your favourite goddesses of love and the comparisons of hermetic Qabalah are obvious!

@TheSilent1 said

"
@Frater Pramudita said
"I certainly see what you're saying, but I suppose I should add that in the course of attempting this translation, I feel that I have now gained at least a novice working knowledge of the language in both speech and writing. Correctly so though, that I am neither an adept, nor did I use a proper working knowledge from my own mind to do the translation (instead relying on the tools at hand). So perhaps I should have started by getting to the working level of the language that I am now, and then attempted to do a translation?"

If you feel that you must work on enochian here is a check list to follow:

You have memorized the tables of 777.
Memorize the Enochian Alphabet.
Mastered all the basic rituals of Liber O.
Paint your own Tablets.
I would recommend learning the Opening by Watchtower and have successfully performed the rite at least 50 times. (This should take at least a year doing the ritual once a week.)
Or learn the Temple Opening from Liber Chanokh and have performed it for as long as I have suggested with the Opening by Watchtower.
Memorize the First Key in english and enochian and use it in place of the Portal Key once you have memorized that and had successful invocations.
Have some level of K&C. i.e. Success in Liber Samekh.

THEN...

Start having fun with some very serious angelic initiators.

72"

Caution in these things doesn't often go awry. I'd also add that it shouldn't be attempted til you've a good deal of maturity about you, say, 30 years or more?

My analogy is that the Great Work is a mountain, and there are many paths to climb it. Some meander here and there, some go only a little way up then enjoy the view. The Enochian Aethyrs are freeclimbing the sheer northern face. It's potent, but the penalties for screwing up are bigger, and there are few safety mechanisms. Enochian Angels can seem very alien to the human consciousness.

@Frater Pramudita said

"Well the idea began when I read Long Milo DuQuette's "Enochian Vision Magick..." What helped me with the bulk of the work were the Enochian translators I found online. But things kept happening while I was working on it; for instance the main one I was using at tikaboo.com would keep going under construction, and that made me think that the translations might be wrong, so then I went to doing it manually using enochian.info and "The Complete Enochian Dictionary..." by Donald Laycock."

There are a number of errors in the enochian on that site (the calls are really bad). Go with Laycock's translations

@Solitarius said

"Try reading Kahlil Gibrans book "the Prophet" for a decent and sensitive exegesis on love, as well as everything else."

...And the poetry of Jalaluddin Rumi; somewhat older, but the good translations are sublime.

@Frater Pramudita said

"Well the idea began when I read Long Milo DuQuette's "Enochian Vision Magick..." What helped me with the bulk of the work were the Enochian translators I found online. But things kept happening while I was working on it; for instance the main one I was using at tikaboo.com would keep going under construction, and that made me think that the translations might be wrong, so then I went to doing it manually using enochian.info and "The Complete Enochian Dictionary..." by Donald Laycock."

I've written some enochian translation software. The hard disks I use to write it on have a shockingly short lifespan!

@Labyrinthus said

"So far on this thread, I have not seen anything about attracting more women into Thelema. (though I do recall it being discussed elsewhere)"

Stopping the penis-measuring contests would be a better start.

@Labyrinthus said

"And for what its worth... I think the role of men in Thelema would be something along the lines of "do as thou wilt". "

Absolutely. Add that it should be "Do what thou wilt" for every man and every woman and you're sold

@TheSilent1 said

"
I have to confess I'm playing devil's advocate by drawing lines in the sand of gender, but I think that it might cause some interesting scripts to come to the surface. Exposing superficial scripts can allow for insight and give the chance to start reprogramming the Meta-scripts that rule the thought process, thereby, increasing the capacity for understanding.

72"

It seems to me that the scripts are the problem. It starts with

"you're a woman/man; you should do this"

and ends with

"you're a citizen; you should think this"

It's the categories that are the problem. Redefining them alleviates the symptoms, but doesn't cure the disease.

@TheSilent1 said

"I have seen much debate going on as to the role of women in Thelema, yet not a single apparent male has truly defined the so called masculine role in Thelema and Magick. Honestly guys, it's quite pathetic that so much time is spent criticizing the roles that "men" perceive that women ought to play that I really want to hear what roles a man ought to play."

Didn't we try that last Aeon? Maybe we just shouldn't be telling people what their roles should or shouldn't be any more?

I'd like to leave it to every Star to decide that for themselves.

@Froclown said

"It means for a woman that she ought to make sure that the right man stocks her up and that under his umbrella she can achieve her Feminine WILL, which is undoubtedly to use her "charms" to manipulate this man into providing her with base material comforts the sort of shallow pointless crap that women like. Shiny stones, fancy garments, new shoes etc. To shaw her off and breed from her a son, that is a continuation of his father's achievements, so than she can wallow in her material things and play her stupid little games of blackmail and envy with her sisters.

Men should store up women, because it is a sign that a man is powerful enough to waste his excess on lower planes, on base material nonsense, like females and the crass things they live for.

Also women can be useful for sex magick, I mean even the best quality ink pen needs something to smear itself on, if it expects to manifest visible signs.

Of course there are ritual formula that avoid contamination with the lower planes all together, if one is so inclined, Certain forms of Eucharist for example. Though some of these deal with the 2 of wands, a card that might give some men apprehension."

The Sufi in me wants all hearts to ache with love til they bleed, but knows that you can't know this until you can surrender yourself to it, and that means throwing yourself to chance every time we meet someone closely.

You've been unlucky in love. I'm guessing you're single, perhaps recently.

It hurts, yes. I'm getting the sense you'd rather be celibate than get hurt again.

You'll get over it. It wont hurt less with time, but the scars will fade. Age teaches wisdom, and the hurt helps us to love. You won't find what you thought was love again until you can be less angry.

You can't receive the kisses of Nuit until you can love her with all your heart.

Compassion is the vice of Kings; who else can afford such an expensive luxury?

Veil not your vices in virtuous words; Every man and every woman is a star.

This is why the are so few women in Thelema.

@Chris Hanlon said

"Hi JAE,
Crowley was a great poet. His prose sings like music, like an aria.
The goods are the riches and valuables that a woman is in charge of for the household. The head of the house, the châtelain, had the keys for all the storage of valuables of food and other things. Just another allusion to gviing up all for the kiss of Nuit, or the experience of the divine.
Think that's it?
In L.V.X.,
chrys333"

Y'know, I think that's probably the best interpretation of that verse I've seen. Bravo!

@sethur said

"One of the problems with Liber Al is knowing when it is addressed to everyone and when just to Crowley. In this case I think it's addressed to Crowley and should be seen as prophecy, accurate as always."

Possibly getting a little controversial here (and maybe off-topic somewhat), but IMO none of it applies only for Crowley. I am the prophet of my Aeon, and Beast for my Babalon. The entirety of Liber AL is all about the various stages of the development of this star in this universe. I'll not understand certain portions at certain times because those parts aren't revelationary to my development at that juncture in time and space.

Of course, in your universe, I'm assuming the same thing applies.

@AvshalomBinyamin said

"
Let me try an example, and if Jim or someone with similar expertise can correct me if I goof up:

I have a flash of inspiration about inventing and building a new musical instrument. I then come up with some plans for how to make it a physical reality. I then gather the tools and materials, and build the instrument according to plans.

The act of inspiration was Briatic. The abstract thinking about making plans was Yetziratic. Physically building the instrument was Assiah. (This, by the way, is the same pattern as in the old testament, when it says that God creates, makes, and forms something, in that order...)

And yet, from the very beginning, this instrument, from inspiration, to physical manifestation, was always about a 'real world' instrument. So all 3 steps were mostly 'in Malkuth', so to speak.

Same Briah, Yetzirah, and Assiah. But the 3 steps were mostly 'in Hod'.

Of course, there is overlap, and no project or activity is entirely in one sphere.

Corrections?"

I'd agree, and add that there's an Atziluthic level preceding those of the impulse to "make music"

@PatchworkSerpen said

"
@Seraph said
" (Grammatical niggle: "Sephirah" is the plural form. The additional "s" doesn't make sense)"

Niggling your niggle: 'Sephirah' is the singular, 'Sephiroth' is the plural "

Damn. Brain fart. You're right. X)