Liber V vel Reguli
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@Jim Eshelman said
"My opinion is that it is anything but a beginner's ritual, regardless of what he meant when he wrote that
In fact, I mostly think this was the ritual he meant when he said he had planted in his writings a trap for the unwary to weed out the foolish.
"So, in your opinion, where do you believe this ritual should be placed within the A.'.A.'. degree structure?
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@Redd Fezz said
"Jim, is this kind of helpful advice given in that big blue book you wrote and intend to republish one day?
While we're on the subject, what rituals are good for neophyte home-schoolers, if any? I just really can't see myself ever joining a lodge."
I think I might have managed not to mention Liber Reguli once in M&AA <g>.
Good for beginners? Honestly, nothing beats the basics. The Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram and the Middle Pillar ritual (in one or another of its basic forms) - to which Thelemites would quickly add Liber Resh and "Will." Six months of persistent daily performance of the Pentagram Ritual, Middle Pillar, and Resh and you'll be in place to see things with quite different eyes.
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@Jim Eshelman said
"Good for beginners? Honestly, nothing beats the basics. The Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram and the Middle Pillar ritual (in one or another of its basic forms) - to which Thelemites would quickly add Liber Resh and "Will." Six months of persistent daily performance of the Pentagram Ritual, Middle Pillar, and Resh and you'll be in place to see things with quite different eyes."
I can personally vouch for the truth of this statement.
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@Her said
"So, in your opinion, where do you believe this ritual should be placed within the A.'.A.'. degree structure?"
Thinking about that now for the first time, since I normally just ignore it completely... And this is all opinion...
Obviously Probationers can undertake whatever they choose, so what I say isn't intended to preclude that.
The advanced (or, at least, well-established) 1=10 has the magical grounding to approach it intelligently (and there is a way in which Reguli's penchant for rather swamp-ugly destablization might occasionally be useful to the Neophyte 1=10).
As a rule, perhaps 2=9 is the proper 'formal' level, for two or three reasons. One, the various skills of the 1=10 are, by definition, fully ripened in the 2=9. Two, the progress made combined with the particular work of 2=9 would probably have one more naturally able to handle the particular things Reguli stirs. But, most especially, it was the 2=9 level that was originally intended to involve the aspirant in Thelema per se. Remember that, originally, The Book of the Law was unpublished and wouldn't have been available (in any form) to anyone below 2=9. Much of that was later rolled back to 0=0, but the crossing into the "Order of Thelema" per se is still a naturally 2=9 phenomenon. Therefore, any ritual professing to specifically stir energies of the Aeon of Horus would find their natural place there (as a starting point).
Those are my thoughts of the moment, in any case.
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93
i have a question on liber 5:
the little enchantment you do at the begining and end with the tracing the lines and the vibrating the names, i dont understand all that?? i mean i kinda see it following the kundalini, but not really, i mean you are touching more things and not everything is where chakras are. can you shead some light onto whats happening here?
thanks
93s
Fr.418
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You are tracing what is called the Hierophantic Cross - a vertical shaft with three horizontals.
These three also correspond to the three horizontal paths on the Tree of Life - Daleth, Teth, and Peh - drawn on the body. These three letters total 4 + 9 + 80 = 93, and also correspond to the Venus, Sun, and Mars chakras.
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No... someplace more chatty, like Confessions or Magick Without Tears or something. (Not remembering where.) I've known the quote for 30 years or so.
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Going back to the subject of Reguli as a potential booby-trap ritual. Wouldn't it be fair to say that the symbolism within Reguli is more a booby trap for people rooted in the Golden Dawn tradition. It contains many elements that run counter to Golden Dawn doctrine. Averse pentagrams, a battery of 11 knocks, taking the direction of Boleskine (North) as East, etc., etc.
I seem to remember Dion Fortune being freaked out by Crowley's Thelemic inovations in one of her books. It seems to have worked on her due to her rigid view of the subject. Is that the key to the booby-trap I wonder? If you have a negative view of the symbolism used in the ritual you will end up with a negative result and overall bad feeling.
Personally I use the direction of Boleskine as East anyway and have never experienced anything negative. Anyone who performs Will does the 11 knocks every time they eat. And as for the "averse pentagram" being a symbol of evil, well that depends on how much you want to buy into Golden Dawn tradition on the subject. I don't.
"Traced as a symbol of good, it should be placed with the single point upward, representing the rule of the Divine Spirit. For if thou shouldst write it with two points upward, it is an evil symbol, affirming the empire of matter over that Divine Spirit which should govern it. See that thou doest it not.
The Pentagram with a single point upwards is called the "Sign of the Microcosm," and is a good symbol, representing man with his arms and legs extended adoring his Creator, and especially the dominion of the Spirit over the four Elements, and consequently of reason over matter.
But with the single point downwards it is a very evil symbol. The Head of the Goat, or Demon's Head, representing the abasement of reason beneath the blind forces of matter, the elevation of anarchy above order, and of the conflicting forces driven by chance above God.The Golden Dawn ~ Israel Regardie."
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@Her said
"Going back to the subject of Reguli as a potential booby-trap ritual. Wouldn't it be fair to say that the symbolism within Reguli is more a booby trap for people rooted in the Golden Dawn tradition. It contains many elements that run counter to Golden Dawn doctrine. Averse pentagrams, a battery of 11 knocks, taking the direction of Boleskine (North) as East, etc., etc."
Actually, I don't think that there is much inherently beneficial from Reguli at all except for people rooted in the G.D. tradition. (Inherent benefit is a different matter than the issue of whether a given person can create benefit for themselves, of course.)
By this I mean that the "break all the rules" quality is the specific detail Crowley had in mind when he said that this invoked the energies of the New Aeon. After all, that was the specific formula he followed to receive Liber L. - he wrote his invocation according to the original rules, and Rose, acting as Scarlet Woman and agent of the Gods, had him break all the rules (to his disgust at the time).
But a "ritual of breaking the rules" doesn't have the desired effect unless one is trained in, practiced in, and committed to those rules. Absent that setup, Reguli doesn't have much more to offer than some clever (or possibly twisted!) gematria.
PS - The A.'.A.'. is specifically a direct inheriter of "the Golden Dawn tradition." A Neophyte 1=10 of A.'.A.'. isn't going to ever make it to 2=9 unless he or she shows experience with and passes examination in Liber O (for example), which drills in the core basics of that tradition. (That's a straightforward Liber 185 and Liber 13 requirement - nothing ambiguous about it.)
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@Her said
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"Being the Ritual of the Mark of the Beast: an incantation proper to invoke the Energies of the Aeon of Horus, adapted for the daily use of the Magician of whatever grade."In a recent online debate I was informed in no uncertain terms, that despite what the opening lines of Liber V might seem to imply, this ritual is actually an advanced ritual and should be left alone by beginners. The argument was that Crowley's use of the word "Magician" implies an advanced practitioner and not a neophyte.
Any thoughts?"
How about Crowley's insistence to beginner grades that ultimately they should do any work they see fit to do.
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Hey Guys,
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law.
This thread started on the day I felt I could start studying this ritual! Too cool.
I know I'm not ready to actually perform it however.
I would suggest looking over what Lon Milo DuQuette has written about this rite in 'The Magick of Thelema', especially his comments on the concept of averse Pentagrams in relation to the ritual. Such as:
'Has Crowley turned the belt of the Zodiac upside down? No. He has turned the Magician upside down.' p. 100
'From the sun's point of view there is no up or down. In order to help liberate the Magician from the old aeon illusion of restricted orientation, Crowley now positions us upside down in the center of the zodiacal belt.'
also p. 100In relation to comments about averse Pentagrams celebrating matter triumphing over spirit:
'In Reguli, however,(...) it is a case of Spirit descending into matter.' p. 101
My opinions on this ritual so far:
It's designed to shake up newly concretized distortions set up during one's initial efforts in relation to the Great Work. It's very much like such operations in Tantrik work.
I think it would help to study Liber XV as well. (But then I think that's just good sense anyway
)Also, play around with tracing pentagrams on the Tree. It's kinda fun, too.
Keep in mind the above comments are from a rank beginner treading water in well, you know.....(Sign of Harpocrates).
Love is the law, love under will.
Regards,
Y.S.
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93
i definetely see the 93 as well as the 156 in the sign of the heirophant as well as for me at least the 5 powers of the sphinx. but i wondering is there anything weird going on there with the kundalini? also like for example:
touch center of forehead, mouth, and his larynx and cry aiwaz!
LIKE WHATS GOING on here?? or would this relate to some secret of an order or something. i am very confused... i mean maybe the 1st cross of the GSH, with kether to daath and the line of daleth??
thanks alot
93s
418
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There are several overlapping frameworks happening, and it would take at least one lengthy essay to touch on them.
But... what do you think is going on? Your confusion is not from the absence of ideas, I think, but from too many competing ideas coexisting. Quiet yourself, and listen to what the main message is rising up.
BTW, kundalini is probably off track - but chakras are surely (at least partly) on the track.
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@Jim Eshelman said
"Actually, I don't think that there is much inherently beneficial from Reguli at all except for people rooted in the G.D. tradition."
That sort of begs the question of why was Reguli practiced as a group ritual at the Abbey of Thelema? The only person there rooted in the Golden Dawn tradition was Crowley himself. (Unless of course it was all for his benefit alone. But that doesn't make much sense.)
In the essay that follows Reguli, Crowley draws attention to Liber AL 1:22....."Bind nothing! Let there be no difference made among you between any one thing & any other thing; for thereby there cometh hurt." With that in mind Crowley's use of the "averse" pentagrams makes sense. Absolute divisions between good and bad would seem to be products of the Aeon of Osiris where an upright pentagram = good, and an averse pentagram = bad. My limited understanding of the Aeon of Horus suggests a more relatavistic approach is needed.
Surely the effect of any symbol used in ritual is dependent on the intent of the magician. The differences between the Golden Dawn and Aurum Solis pentagrams is testament to that.
Everyone learns to use the pentagram in it's upright state and identifies with it as a positive symbol. But does that create division because suddenly "averse" becomes bad? Is Reguli then a corrective?
Is there a link with the Hierophant card in the Thoth tarot. Typically Crowley makes no mention of the averse pentagram on that card.
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@Her said
"That sort of begs the question of why was Reguli practiced as a group ritual at the Abbey of Thelema? The only person there rooted in the Golden Dawn tradition was Crowley himself."
Everybody seems to keep missing that the core training of the A.'.A.'. is barely discernible from the Golden Dawn training in the main points.
"(Unless of course it was all for his benefit alone. But that doesn't make much sense.)"
Actually, it makes a lot of sense. During that time he did a lot of ritual development and magical working that was extremely autistic within his highly distinctive magical universe. (This produced some very valuable records and results, btw.)
I'm not saying that's the case - I suspect the real reason is that he was working on it and just wanted to involve "all hands on deck" in testing it, or just wanted to see the effect.
I make no comment on any of the comments here concerning the direction of the pentagrams. Anything new I have to say on the matter would be either obligated Outer Order content, or wouldn't be likely to be understood by people below 5=6 A.'.A.'. (or in some cases 2=9), or would just be intellectual padding. I don't think it's the biggest issue in the whole thing, and there is more that remains unchanged in the geometry of the Pentagram than changes when it is rotated. That in isolation is not a big deal, though that in context of other elements in the ritual, and especially the developmental level of the magician, make a big difference.
"Surely the effect of any symbol used in ritual is dependent on the intent of the magician."
That's always an element, but I think it is too much overlooked that many of these things have objective value.
One place where intent matters a great deal seems to be the direction of circumambulation. A lot of work was done on that in Cefalu that survives in Jane's diaries and other records. There are (I'm not stopping to count and itemize them at the moment) about five different distinct known effects of widdershins circumambulation, and this varies with the ritual, the context, and the intent. On the other hand, there is at least one decisively objective result, which is that it sets up a current (of greater or lesser duration) in the direction in which it is performed. So there are objective elements mingling with (what in this case are more considerable) results depedent on intent or context.
Also, a word about intent: Conscious intent is far from the only element. Subconscious intent is enormously powerful; and, when you use symbols, you are directly speaking the language of subconsciousness. Dependinng on your awake, conscious participation in subconsciousness' participation in that, your use of symbols may, in fact, be rewriting subconscious intention during the course of the ritual regardless of conscious intent.
"The differences between the Golden Dawn and Aurum Solis pentagrams is testament to that."
That's a matter of training, and the reason I don't recommend people mix those systems. One must develop the inner habit of unthinkingly knowing what one is drawing and what it relates to.
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@Jim Eshelman said
"I make no comment on any of the comments here concerning the direction of the pentagrams. Anything new I have to say on the matter would be either obligated Outer Order content, or wouldn't be likely to be understood by people below 5=6 A.'.A.'. (or in some cases 2=9), or would just be intellectual padding."
I guess that means "end of discussion"?
Thanks anyway Jim. Your comments have given me much to think about.One thing has just come to mind though concerning Reguli. A little footnote in MTP, chp13. For some reason Crowley mentions Reguli in connection with banishing!
"Let the banishing therefore be short, but in no wise slurred - for it is useful, as it tends to produce the proper attitude of mind for the invocations. "The Banishing Ritual of the Pentagram" (as now rewritten) is the best to use. *
- See also the ritual called "The Mark of the Beast" given in an Appendix. But this is pantomorphous."
As far as I know pantomorphous means something can take all forms. So is Crowley suggesting that Reguli could be used in the same manner as the GRP?
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@Her said
"I guess that means "end of discussion"?"
Nope! Go ahead and talk about it. At most, it means end of my discussion. Let the party continue!
"One thing has just come to mind though concerning Reguli. A little footnote in MTP, chp13. For some reason Crowley mentions Reguli in connection with banishing!
"Let the banishing therefore be short, but in no wise slurred - for it is useful, as it tends to produce the proper attitude of mind for the invocations. "The Banishing Ritual of the Pentagram" (as now rewritten) is the best to use. *"
"That's referring to the Star Ruby, not Liber Reguli. The footnote is misleading, probably an editor's screw-up. (I'm going off your quote, don't have a copy here at work.)
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There are two footnotes to that line in MTP. The first one mentions the Star Ruby, but the second one points to Reguli.
""The Banishing Ritual of the Pentagram" (as now rewritten, Liber 333, Cap. XXV) is the best to use.*
**See also the Ritual called "The Mark of the Beast" given in an Appendix. But this is pantomorphous.*"