Questions on Liber Pleiades
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Is the "triangle" the sign of fire to be made in all four quarters?
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Would it be correct to visualize Therion as the Great Beast - i.e. humanity or Leviathan?
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A) Why are the four wardens names of winds? B) Is the "Seven" ("within me blaze the Seven") a reference to the seven planets/seven chakras or the Seven Sisters of the Pleiades?
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@he atlas itch said
"6. Is the "triangle" the sign of fire to be made in all four quarters?"
The one over the forehead? Yes. This isn't employed as a sign of Fire (which it resembles but doesn't quite march). It's a triangle surrounding your "third eye" - an "eye in the triangle" symbol (among other things).
"9. Would it be correct to visualize Therion as the Great Beast - i.e. humanity or Leviathan?"
I don't consider The Great Beast as the same as Leviathan. And, though 666 in Revelations is a reference to humanity, that's not the main characteristic of the archetype I understand AC as having embodied (the solar-logos of the Aeon etc.).
But that's interpretive. To answer your question: Within Temple of Thelema there is a specific theurgic image employed that is distinctive to our Mystery. But that's just an individual case. In general, find your own distinctive images for Therion and Babalon.
"11. A) Why are the four wardens names of winds? "
(1) Why not?
(2) I wanted Greek names. These are ones that, for almost 40 years and in different contexts, I've used for the Kerubic guardians of the quarters. They are highly distinctive to the directions themselves by etymology, and serve very well."B) Is the "Seven" ("within me blaze the Seven") a reference to the seven planets/seven chakras or the Seven Sisters of the Pleiades?"
Excellent question: The Seven originally referred to the underlying formula of the ritual, the seven deities invoked. But, at the ripeness of the ritual, the "four without" - visible on the horizontal plane - spoke spontaneously (during the creation of the ritual) to the "seven within," the chakras as you mentioned. This gave rise to the idea of "seven stars" (the chakras being alternately called "interior stars"), and thus to the image of the Pleiades.
I didn't say anything about the theory of the ritual, since the publication was purely pragmatic; but I might as well give a bit of its development here. This ritual was a ceremonial working out of a concept arising from consideration of the core Thelemic deities. Starting with the idea that the three chapters of Liber L. represent three core ideas of Mother, Father, Child, the Level I deities would be Nuit, Hadit, and Heru-Ra-Ha. But each of these has derivative expressions. Nuit is expressed, on a lower octave, by Babalon, and Hadit by Therion; and Heru-Ra-Ha is a twin god expressed in the discrete aspects of Ra-Hoor-Khuit and Hoor-paar-kraat. This now gave an expression of "the Three above the Four," which shows in many places: The idea of Shin as the Spirit point of the Pentagram just being one example.
So I wrote a ritual modelled roughly on the Pentagram Ritual wherein the opening would give experience of The Three in their integration; then this would step down to the Microcosmic level where The Four would be the quarters. Then, at the center, Aiwass (or, alternately, the name of one's own HGA if known) would serve as the linkage point between the Above (Within) and Below (Without). In looking about me at this point in developing the ritual, and also thinking about the overall pattern of the Seven, I recognized a 4=7 / 7=4 formulation and wrapped up the ritual in conformity with it.
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@Jim Eshelman said
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@he atlas itch said
"11. A) Why are the four wardens names of winds? "(2) I wanted Greek names. These are ones that, for almost 40 years and in different contexts, I've used for the Kerubic guardians of the quarters. They are highly distinctive to the directions themselves by etymology, and serve very well."
What is the significance of GREEK names for the four wardens? You have stated in the past that Crowley, in selecting the names of the wardens in the Star Ruby, did not delve too deeply into their nature, but was simply looking for Greek names. So what is the significance of Greek in this context?
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@he atlas itch said
"What is the significance of GREEK names for the four wardens?"
I wouldn't say there's a "significance" to it. It's where I wanted to go. That particular ritual didn't feel it should be Hebrew. It was one of those artistic decisions one makes along the way.
Y'know, usually Elvis Presley did rock and roll, but sometimes he'd do a ballad. Same thing.
I suppose I could have done Latin (for example), but that always seems too stiff, and I reserve it for "canonical" things. Greek hit the intuitive mark.
"You have stated in the past that Crowley, in selecting the names of the wardens in the Star Ruby, did not delve too deeply into their nature, but was simply looking for Greek names. So what is the significance of Greek in this context?"
If I'm understanding you correctly, your question isn't about why these names in particular, but why Greek per se (answered above). The ritual felt Hellenic as it was building. That also BTW probably determined the eventual name, because I might not have otherwise made the leap to name the "seven star" ritual after figures (the seven daughters of Atlas) from Greek mythology.
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Thanks for the extensive explanation. I look forward to trying this ritual out...
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In the past I used to do either LBRP + Middle Pillar or LBRP + invoking Lesser Hexagram Ritual as a general daily practise - i.e. working on the 5+6 formula.
I am thinking of doing the combination of Star Ruby + Liber Pleiades as a daily practise and wondering whether the effect will be the same. Or should Liber Pleiades only be used in context of a full ceremonial magick working?
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@he atlas itch said
"I am thinking of doing the combination of Star Ruby + Liber Pleiades as a daily practise and wondering whether the effect will be the same. Or should Liber Pleiades only be used in context of a full ceremonial magick working?"
It can be used in isolation - more or less in the same sense that, say, the Pentagram ritual can be used by itself or as part of something larger.
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Atlas Itch, thanks for posting your initial questions. They were my questions too. And Jim, thanks for answering. A couple more questions
For some reason, I thought the pentagrams in the forehead were to be visualized in red, but the text just says "luminous". Is red wrong, or should they just be bright light?
Likewise, what about the circle of light? My instinct was to make it gold, but the text doesn't specify. Also, green is an attractive possibility here (Linea viridis gyrat universa).
Does it matter much, or am I making mountains of molehills? (But isn't making a Mountain of a molehill the aim of the Great Work?
)By the way, I'm finding this ritual very uplifting. I come away feeling as if my body were made of stars.
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@gmugmble said
"For some reason, I thought the pentagrams in the forehead were to be visualized in red, but the text just says "luminous". Is red wrong, or should they just be bright light?"
For this ritual, I personally use bright white. It fits the tone of the ritual better for me. But the text was intentionally vague, so red isn't wrong.
"Likewise, what about the circle of light? My instinct was to make it gold, but the text doesn't specify. Also, green is an attractive possibility here (Linea viridis gyrat universa)."
I would make it the same color as the pentagrams, or white. (These two options are consistent with the range of other similar rituals.)
"Does it matter much, or am I making mountains of molehills? (But isn't making a Mountain of a molehill the aim of the Great Work?
) "Only if it's Abiegnis
"By the way, I'm finding this ritual very uplifting. I come away feeling as if my body were made of stars."
Fantastic. Yes, it's almost deceptively powerful, no?
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While pondering the “four and seven” of Liber Pleiades the other day, I came across these lines in Chapter 83, Papyrus of Ani (to assume the form of a phoenix):
*I flew up from primeval matter. I came into being as Khepri; I flourished as a plant; I was hidden like a turtle.
I am the seed of every god. I am yesterday of the four [quarters of the world], and of these seven Uraei who come into being in the eastern land, the great one who illuminates the people with his body.
The god is Set. Thoth is between them in judgement for the one who is at the head of Letopolis, together with the souls of Heliopolis, the flood being between them.
I have come. I am arisen, and glorious, strong and divine among the gods.
I am Khons, of all the wrath of the wind.
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Also:The voyage * is divided into twelve equal divisions, according to the twelve hours of the night. It is further divided into four divisions according to the four wind directions: North, South, East and West.
(Helck and Otto, 1984: 185)
Maybe it's just me, but I saw a connection between these motifs of resurrection and description of Liber Pleiades as "shifting the plane of the magician and the space".
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Jung's analysis of the 3 and 4 in "Archetypes and the Unconscious" is interesting. The 3 becoming for seems to be a little analogous in Jung's mine with the Pentagram and the Hexagram relationship.
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Am I wrong to assume, from the lack of note otherwise, that the pentagrams are visualized fully formulated?
As in, they are neither invoking nor banishing pentagrams.. just, er.. pentagrams?
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@Uni_Verse said
"Am I wrong to assume, from the lack of note otherwise, that the pentagrams are visualized fully formulated?"
Fully formed, exactly as in Star Ruby and similar rituals. (Sorry, I thought this was clear from, "Visualize a luminous pentagram upon your forehead.")
"As in, they are neither invoking nor banishing pentagrams.. just, er.. pentagrams?"
Exactly!
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@Jim Eshelman said
"Fully formed, exactly as in Star Ruby and similar rituals. (Sorry, I thought this was clear from, "Visualize a luminous pentagram upon your forehead.")"
Being that the Star Ruby is always referenced as a banishing ritual, I thought you would be drawing banishing pentagram. I have never performed the ritual, so this is a good thing to know when I decide to give it a whirl
I performed Liber Pleiades earlier today,it felt very natural...
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@Uni_Verse said
"Being that the Star Ruby is always referenced as a banishing ritual, I thought you would be drawing banishing pentagram. I have never performed the ritual, so this is a good thing to know when I decide to give it a whirl
"Nope. Fully formed pentagram.
"I performed Liber Pleiades earlier today,it felt very natural..."
Sweet.
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Given the flexibility of Liber Pleiades, and by flexibility I mean the fact that it is neither a banishing ritual nor an invoking but can be used as either/or, would it make sense to do an LBRP prior to doing it just as a precautionary measure?
I plan on doing the ritual alone for the first time.
I did a group working yesterday with 2 other people, one male and one female.
I opened the space with the LIRP.
The other male stepped it up with the LBRH.
The female did Liber Pleiades.
I closed the space with the LBRP.
It was incredible.
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@Reef said
"Given the flexibility of Liber Pleiades, and by flexibility I mean the fact that it is neither a banishing ritual nor an invoking but can be used as either/or, would it make sense to do an LBRP prior to doing it just as a precautionary measure? "
If you feel uncertainty about yourself or the space, yes... if nothing else, as kind of a warm-up. I generally only do it in dedicated temple space, and in those conditions I don't feel a need to do so.
"I did a group working yesterday with 2 other people, one male and one female.
I opened the space with the LIRP.
The other male stepped it up with the LBRH.
The female did Liber Pleiades.
I closed the space with the LBRP.
It was incredible."
Thanks for the report
Glad it spoke to you. Yes, I find it to be a very beautiful and powerful tool for the right conditions. -
The entire performance felt extremely natural. There was sort of a "stair-step", compounding feeling in the air, kinda like leaping to the top of the earth, then into the planetary belt, then into outer space. Very beautiful indeed.