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Calculating gematria

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved Qabbalah
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    el23
    wrote on last edited by
    #1

    Ok, re: Gematria...

    I have had a look around the net, as well as at previous threads from this forum, but haven't yet found a suitable answer to this question:

    In this day and age of technological wizardry, does anyone know of a reliable gematria calculator that is available online?

    I came across this site: www.mysticalinternet.com/gematria/index.php, which is amazing in principle, however anything that I seem to plug in doesn't seem to work. Ex. Thelema or Agape in the Greek engine do not equate to 93.

    I've recently become intrigued by the idea of the NAEQ or cryptonumerology, but I'm especially interested in using something like this for working with Grant's Typhonian Trilogies, yet all of the gematria in his books do not seem to work with the engines on the site either -- yes, yes, I know that much of his gematria is suspect to begin with. Still, what am I missing?

    What practical methods do any of you use when dabbling in gematria? Work it out by hand?

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    Frater SOL
    replied to el23 on last edited by
    #2

    @el23 said

    "Work it out by hand?"

    Exactly.

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    Edward Mason
    replied to el23 on last edited by
    #3

    93,

    These posts have been moved here from the thread on 93 93/93 in 'Thelema'. This is a completely different topic.

    93 93/93,

    EM

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    el23
    replied to el23 on last edited by
    #4

    Sorry about that. You're right. Thanks for moving it over.

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    Ophion280
    replied to el23 on last edited by
    #5

    For a quick reference the OTO has a gematria calculator in their 'Tools' section that is multilingual and concise.

    You can find it here:http: <!-- w --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.oto-usa.org/cgi-bin/achad/achad.cgi">www.oto-usa.org/cgi-bin/achad/achad.cgi</a><!-- w -->

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    Jim Eshelman
    replied to el23 on last edited by
    #6

    @el23 said

    "...Grant's Typhonian Trilogies, yet all of the gematria in his books do not seem to work with the engines on the site either -- yes, yes, I know that much of his gematria is suspect to begin with. Still, what am I missing? "

    No, I don't think you're missing anything. Grant either can't, or won't, add correctly. I've rarely seen much of his math add up correctly.

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    el23
    replied to el23 on last edited by
    #7

    @phoinix93 said

    "For a quick reference the OTO has a gematria calculator in their 'Tools' section that is multilingual and concise.

    You can find it here:http: <!-- w --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.oto-usa.org/cgi-bin/achad/achad.cgi">www.oto-usa.org/cgi-bin/achad/achad.cgi</a><!-- w -->"

    Thank you! This will definitely help. If only it had the same feature as the site that I mentioned, which lists other words that have the same values - an invaluable feature, even if the math seems to be flawed.

    @Jim Eshelman said

    "No, I don't think you're missing anything. Grant either can't, or won't, add correctly. I've rarely seen much of his math add up correctly."

    Sadly, I am finding this to be true the more that I cross-reference between his books and secondary sources.

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    Aum418
    replied to el23 on last edited by
    #8

    @Jim Eshelman said

    "
    @el23 said
    "...Grant's Typhonian Trilogies, yet all of the gematria in his books do not seem to work with the engines on the site either -- yes, yes, I know that much of his gematria is suspect to begin with. Still, what am I missing? "

    No, I don't think you're missing anything. Grant either can't, or won't, add correctly. I've rarely seen much of his math add up correctly."

    Nor have I.

    Grant's Typhonian Trilogies are a gigantic set of fiction with occult themes.

    IAO131

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    sethur
    replied to el23 on last edited by
    #9

    Grant doesn't do his own gematria - he gives tasks to students - and forgets to check. I sub-edited Hecate's Fountain for Chris Johnson and found so many mistakes Chris only dared point out a few, scared he would insult Grant and lose the contract.

    The most obvious was IXAXAAR, which Grant had based a lot of his stuff around on the basis that it adds up to 333. Unfortunately it doesn't. Someone, one of his students, obviously got as far as IXAXAA=131 and went "Yes! 333!" forgetting that while Resh = 200 in Hebrew gematria, Rho = 100 in Greek gematria. I suggested, almost tongue-in-cheek, that it be spelled IShAShAAR in Hebrew to get the 333 and Grant went for it - but gave the credit to Chris. IShAShAAR makes no sense as a Hebrew spelling, you wouldn't get 2 alephs in a row like that.

    Lots of Gematria errors went through, but not as many, I hope, as in Outside the Circles of Time, where one guy I knew counted up to 100 gematria errors before giving up.

    Having said that, Grant insists that gematria is a creative, not analytic, art.

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    el23
    replied to el23 on last edited by
    #10

    @sethur said

    "Grant doesn't do his own gematria - he gives tasks to students - and forgets to check. I sub-edited Hecate's Fountain for Chris Johnson and found so many mistakes Chris only dared point out a few, scared he would insult Grant and lose the contract.

    The most obvious was IXAXAAR, which Grant had based a lot of his stuff around on the basis that it adds up to 333. Unfortunately it doesn't. Someone, one of his students, obviously got as far as IXAXAA=131 and went "Yes! 333!" forgetting that while Resh = 200 in Hebrew gematria, Rho = 100 in Greek gematria. I suggested, almost tongue-in-cheek, that it be spelled IShAShAAR in Hebrew to get the 333 and Grant went for it - but gave the credit to Chris. IShAShAAR makes no sense as a Hebrew spelling, you wouldn't get 2 alephs in a row like that.

    Lots of Gematria errors went through, but not as many, I hope, as in Outside the Circles of Time, where one guy I knew counted up to 100 gematria errors before giving up.

    Having said that, Grant insists that gematria is a creative, not analytic, art."

    Very interesting. Thank you for that. The fact that Grant's gematria is to be taken as a creative art seems to be the ultimate cop-out to me, as the books in the trilogies seem to treat everything very seriously and as a matter of fact. I think it is unfortunate and I'm glad that I took the time to verify all of this without taking it at face value. I think I'll still work my way through the books, but with with far less enthusiasm and care. Having said this, I would imagine there will be a full set of the trilogies for sale on ebay sometime very soon.

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    Michael Staley
    replied to el23 on last edited by
    #11

    @sethur said

    "Grant doesn't do his own gematria - he gives tasks to students - and forgets to check."

    I don't know told you that, but it's not true. As a "student" of Grant's since 1976, I can assure you of that.

    @sethur said

    "I sub-edited Hecate's Fountain for Chris Johnson and found so many mistakes Chris only dared point out a few, scared he would insult Grant and lose the contract."

    Kenneth Grant writes his books in rapid bursts of inspiration, and doesn't always go back and check. Then again, an editor should be capable of doing this, and bringing such slips to the author's attention; any editor who feels unable to do this should clearly not be editing. As Grant's publisher and editor for ten years now, I have never had problems in pointing out errors to Grant; he doesn't take it as an insult.

    @sethur said

    "Lots of Gematria errors went through, but not as many, I hope, as in Outside the Circles of Time, where one guy I knew counted up to 100 gematria errors before giving up."

    Yes, there were a lot of errors in the 1980 edition of Outside the Circles of Time, and an attentive editor would have brought them to the attention of the author. The 2008 edition of the book correct most of these.

    @sethur said

    "Having said that, Grant insists that gematria is a creative, not analytic, art."

    Well, finally something that I can agree with. Grant uses gematria largely to underpin his insights, rather than the gematrical relationships leading him to those insights. Thus the gematria is one more element in the picture he is painting. A case in point is Outside the Circles of Time, where the errors in gematria did not really detract from the picture that Grant was painting. Most people who read that book were not interested in the gematria; it was the sweeps of imagination that held their attention. Quite right, too.

    Best wishes,

    Michael.

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    Parsifal
    replied to el23 on last edited by
    #12

    Work it out by hand.

    For the sake of magickal formulae, Crowley often changed a letter here and there to fit what he was trying to accomplish. As a magician there is nothing wrong with this, even if an orthodox speaker of the language would tell you its wrong.

    An example of how you do Gematria:

    YHVH = 10+5+6+5 = 26

    26 is one idea, related to other ideas of the same number (though not every idea that has the number 26 for its gematria will relate, for example)
    2 & 6 are seperate ideas
    2+6 = 8 is another idea
    26 = 12 is another idea
    2 to the 6th power (2
    22222 = 64) is another idea
    Then... 6+4 = 10 another idea
    6 and 4 another idea
    6*4 = 24 another idea
    6 to the 4th power (1296) is another idea-

    Eventually you tend to hit a wall. Its important to understand the limit of Gematria, and when it has exceeded its usefulness. The idea is that, the more you analyze the numbers, the further away from the core idea (of 26) you are getting. This is also the da'athic danger of gematria, of knowing where the boundry between extracting hidden knowledge from an idea, and going off on a complete distraction.

    You can then take YHVH, and spell it in full: YVD (20) HH (10) VV (12) HH (10)= 52, and on and on....

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