The Number of Self Pity
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@Tinman said
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I disagree with your equating the concept of self-pity to sin (Atheists can self-pity
"yeah, I see your point. when I said 'sin' I had in mind that the core idea in self-pity is in placing the Divine somewhere 'oustide' of us (either in various theistic forms, or the atheistic form of placing it out-of-existence).
because, what do we feel pity for? for something that is weak. and this lack-of-strenght feeling is obviously a consequence of (in this or that form) feeling of non-connectedness to the Divine.
so... experiencing this separation through Love - is the ultimate cure, I suppose.
as you said -->"Nuit has that great line... "To Me." "
for She is divided for Love's sake...
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@Tinman said
"1. It's based on not being able to get out of your own point of view, or seeing the validity in others points of view.
- Nuit has that great line... "To Me." Nuit would initially seem to me to be a great help in breaking free of self-pity, however, the great line of the self-pity monster is "Why is this all happening... to me!" Don't have an answer to that one... just something rattling around in my brain."
This was a major hang up for me (at one point) in my Going. There was always the push to want to achieve something, yet I always would fall short of the Ideal. This would cause self-pity for me. I would agree with Danica, that the problem stems from fear of not being able to achieve, which (to me) stems from wanting to achieve a certain projection in this lifetime...and obsessing about it. We set up the projection, and when the goal isn't met, we feel bad about it. At least, that was partly my experience...
@Tinman said
"You could boil it all down to 1, since in 1 implies 2, etc."
I think this is an excellent point -- the problem arises when we divide into AL and LA: it is the duality that causes difference. The accepting of our identity as "I" and "Not-I" simultaneously presents great psychological difficulty, but it is also necessary for balance. The Will-to-Live and the Will-to-Die are essential parts of this. Then, everything we haven't achieved is still our "identity", because we are United to the "Not-I". Or, our Angel "picks up the slack", and everything is built to Perfection in the balancing of the opposites -- through the Spirit or the "communication" between the Microcosm and the Macrocosm. This is really hard for me to explain, and it may only make sense to me, but it works for me.
@danica said
"for She is divided for Love's sake..."
Yes! And a wonderful ride it is! The Joy is in the Going!
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I'm going to tentatively throw out a number based on your comments (thank you both), and my own thoughts, and see what you think:
247
Putting the 2 first (I like the notion that self-pity comes from setting up the duality - the goal of I don't have, or am not X.)
Before the 4 - the authoritative wanting control
Before the sacred 7 - The love bit that is lacking
247 = 13x19
2+4+7 = 13
we keep coming back to 13, or Unity / Love - which is the quality that self-pity seems to be the opposite of (in one way), and so may be appropriateAlso self-pity can be similar to "death"...
pondering...
From sepher sephiroth
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247Angel L.T.D. of Capricorn ALVYR
To overwhelm (Ps. lxxvii. 18); ZRM
a flood
A light MAVR
Night Demon of 1st Dec. Taurus RAVM
Sensus symbolicus RMZ"
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Upon further meditation... 247 did not strike me as correct. Perhaps it's the inevitable association I have with 24-7... but it doesn't carry a sense of "correctness" with it, for the concept "self-pity".
I'm currently rolling the number 141 around in my head. 4 dividing the 1. Also it just sounds like the self centered point of view - one for one... but doesn't necessarily have the quality of "pity" that I'm looking for...
1+4+1 = 6 - beauty divided (emphasis on the separation) for love's sake?
pi = 3.1415... 141 trapped behind the 3. and the 5... between understanding and force (both things which would eradicate the feelings of self-pity
141 is a semiprime: a product of two prime numbers, namely 3 and 47
" 141
Robust; oaken AMYTz
Gathered, collected ASP
Angel of 4 P. KVQYH
Precept MTzVH
Trusty, steady NAMN
L.A. Angel of Cancer PKYAL
Prima QMA
"Any help out there? Where my 3=8s at?
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I really like "252".
Work with that and see if anything resonates for you?
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Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law.
I almost didn't post this - gematria is so personal. Anyway...
I've settled with "179" instead of "252". It seems more accurate.
Some principle numbers:
SELF PITY
S+E+L+F + P+I+T+Y
60 + 5 + 30 + 6 + 80 + 10 + 9 + 10 = 210!210 is N.O.X.! The idea the energy being built and resolved (amongst other things)
- 31 taking away the united duality of Not God and God
= 179
179 + 333 (Choronzon - the demon of the mind - the Abyss/Da'ath) = 412 = the number of Beth spelled in full - illusion or the Magus, duality, also a longing for. Interesting. It seems self-pity is dualistic with positive and negative attributes. But, it is two words that we're deducing (self and pity).
From 777:
61 = I, myself (also not)
68 = to pity (also to be wise)
50 = pains, sorrows (also unclean, unpure)Myself and not, nothing (61) and pains (50) adds to 111 (Aleph, a title of Kether, AUM.) The swirling energy negative and positive. This shows the Unity of movement, from the positive to the negative. A glyph of duality in an intimate sense. Almost, as if the pain is added to make us move and grow.
"Myself" added "to pity" equals 129, which is "pleasure", so there is an element of pleasure in self-pity, but if we add the normal focal point insinuated by self pity, or the negativity of self-pity (the pain), we come up with 179, which means "ligatio" or "imprisonment, bondage, captivity, servitude."
One could say, it is learning to live with the energy of duality that is pleasure, yet, the negative side (dwelling on pain), ends in servitute.
There is a sh*t ton of other ways to do this, through reduction, factorals, and they all seem to jive to me. I would say to keep going with your research.
Although, as you know - what the thinker thinks, the prover proves.
Some reduction:
61 - 6+1 = 7
50 - 5 + 0 = 5
68 - 6 +8 = 14 = 5Showing Tiphareth, Kether, the passionate influence, the Magus, the dissolution (not), Art, and the fear/strength influence...
I hope this is helpful. Most of all, have fun with your research!!!
Also...wanted to add...
N.O.X. is Martial, corresponding to Geburah.
Love is also equal to 111.
Love is the law, love under will.
- 31 taking away the united duality of Not God and God
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I understand that a dogmatic qabalistic number for "self-pity" might be flat or false - but I really appreciate the help and think it's an interesting project. Perhaps I would have gotten more takers if I choose a more fun idea rather than "self-pity"... oh well
Frater 639 - my own personal relationship with 179 isn't heading into the depths of self-pity. I'm getting a different vibe.
1+7+9=17 - Aleph as a Thunderbolt
179 = (17 x 9) + (17 + 9)
So 17 and 9 have strong influences - Star and Hermit.
179, = "ligatio" or "imprisonment, bondage, captivity, servitude."
Current impression, for me, is that 179 represents the bondage with which we are each individually enslaved by our own "True Wills"... pity or pride (neither play a strong factor for me in the essence of the number which is the binding of Hermit to Star, Player to Path).
But I'm still thinking about it.
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"Has anyone figured out a number of the concept "self-pity"? I would appreciate any advice on finding a valid numerical representative.
"Stating your intent may help others think with you more precisely.
"the taint of self-pity"
Pick a gross number. lol..
P.S. If you pick a clock number, you risk seeing it all frickin' day...
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"Stating your intent may help others think with you more precisely."
I would appreciate any advice on finding a valid numerical representative for the concept of self-pity. Your work is absolutely appreciated as well, as I will most likely learn new techniques and ways of thinking about things in your explanations. I've been doing a lot of work recently with looking at Crowley's notes on various numbers and trying to understand the reasons why... I'm attempting to do the same thing on a public forum, with public support but working backwards - concept first, then number. I choose "self-pity" as I was feeling some at the moment of the question's origination.
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@Tinman said
"Current impression, for me, is that 179 represents the bondage with which we are each individually enslaved by our own "True Wills"... pity or pride (neither play a strong factor for me in the essence of the number which is the binding of Hermit to Star, Player to Path)."
Yes. I see where you are coming from with those influences -- I can also see how reconciling the Hermit and the Star may be difficult when it comes to self-pity.
I always go by the rule of thumb of how a number personally resonates with us...and how that makes us grow in our understanding. I was (more or less) just throwing different techniques out there with explanation...using strict Tarot guidelines can be useful, too.
Just as an exercise, if I personally took your ideas further, it would go something like this:
Self-pity (without the negative bias) could be considered like fuel to be transmuted into aspiration (Star) -- like strength? Or, one could say, the "Secret Seed" (Yod) which corresponds to the Hermit? Nine is also the number of Yesod...it could be linking mind (Player) to the aspiration (Path)? The Spirit is sometimes referred to as Yod -- and the coordination of the Hermit seems to have some qualities of Geburah -- like the Spirit coordinating the elements in the Pentagrammation. I also find it interesting that both Trump paths lead to Tiphareth from the "Force" side of the Tree...the root cause of pity and/or pride both seem like forces that can enable change (whether from Chokmah or Chesed).
Or 179 could be the Pick 3 on my Lotto card.
@Tinman said
"179 = (17 x 9) + (17 + 9)"
Nice correlations! Didn't see that when I was working with it!