Questioning Resh
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@Frater Potater said
"How you ever been in favor of your students just performing the adoration from the stele, and not doing the rest of the ritual? Are the same results achieved, etc?"
I don't believe the same results are achieved. - It's certainly possible, of course (especially after a time of long habituation and building inner channels), that some people could find that this was effective enough. For me, when I tried exactly that approach, it just seemed to be missing too much. (Not enough connection to the Sun per se, nor to the specific traits of the quarters. It was a recurring practice, but not one anchoring me specifically to the time of day.)
"I believe that the system and symbolism presented in Thelema, to be drastically different from any other religion which the world has yet known. I think it's inherent nature is to bring us to a completely new and revolutionary conception of the what the word "religion" has meant to us up until now."
Possibly you mean, "what it has meant for the last couple of thousand years." Or (with what you have told me of your history), I can especially understand that you mean "what religion has meant to me in the past." People with strong conventional religious upbringings usually have to break away from the whole thing for a while before they can discover religion on their own terms.
But (politics and social engineering aside), religion has always meant the same as yoga. The first literally means "reconnecting," and the second means "union."
"It seems like the nature of this aeon is that we each have our own personal mystery to unfold."
That's always been the actuality, though not always the point of focus. However, note that unfolding your own mystery doesn't mean not participating in collecive mystery. The big blind of many in Thelema today is focussing on the individual at the cost of the collective. That individuality aspect (most articulated in Chapter 2) is just the Osiris aeon ego stuff seen through a new lens, just as the collective aspect (most articulated in Chapter 1) is just the Isis aeon subconsciousness stuff seen through a new lens. What's new - what's truly New Aeon - is the coexistence of the mother and the father in the child - the coexistence of the collective and the individual - being not just "one star" but, equally, "in the company of stars."
And, simply put: Forging mass-mind constructs is one of the most powerful tools we have for working with individuals and furthering everybody's needs.
"This is in contrast to the past where a priest, or monarch, or someone else, dictated these things to the laity."
Agreed. Or, at least, for the adept, what you say is exactly true. But it isn't really true (not in any practical, real-world sense) for those who aren't at least close to adepthood. The world still has (and needs) caretakers, and the caretakers are responsible for tending to the children until they're ready to stand as spiritual adults.
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@Veronica said
"I think though that I am hard wired much differently then most and have a different degree of spiritual inclination naturally. Four planets in Scorpio maybe..."
Strengh, Beauty, Joy, Stillness.
Yup, fits.
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The short answer for 1-3 : Yes
Some expansion to follow@Frater Potater said
"
- Why practice Liber Resh at all?"
This question is something of a doozy,
My initial response was "Why not?"
That is not productive to discussionFor one, it is a simple, easy ritual that does not take much time out of the day
Personally, I see it as one of the most important practices -
Feeling that beyond Resh, Will and the LBRP everything else is bells and whistlesAnything which would come close to the effect, would be quite similar to Resh in my opinion
Not only does it provide practice at some of the most important elements of a magick practice
It creates a connection to the Sun, a rythem for a persons life
A constant reminder, if you will, to stop and smell the Rose
And give thanks to all those things which make your life possible -
Frater Potater,
I once rewrote Resh without all the Egyptian stuff. It's at home, or I'd post it.
It removed the Egyptian names and replaced them with Son, Mother, Father, and Daughter, but it gave them basically the same characteristics as in Resh.
I did this because I saw each as an aspect of my own psyche. Through the process of impressing the unconscious mind with the positive images for male-self and female-self, young-self and old-self, I hypothesized that the effect would be to work to correct (dare I say "redeem"?) negative personal psychological associations with any of these pieces of my whole self.
The effect that it began to have on me was an experience of... hmmm... for succinctness, I'll simply call it a sense of nostalgia, almost, for my own family and familiness writ large. Divine Family kind of thing. Maybe that sounds trivial, but it was quite powerfully personally meaningful. Not nostalgia like longing - I'm trying to express the feeling of being in the midst of it.
Note: I did eventually resist some of the associations with Daughter as Kephra and sleeping and silence. I think I had said something like "I will bless the Daughter in her sleeping and eventual awakening." I think in that case, the two different forms clashed a bit.
It was only after rewriting it and working with it that way that I was comfortable with actual Resh.
I say all this because I think, psychologically speaking, it serves the same purpose - to present the mind with positive, corrective images of the stages of life and the natural forces - given in the gods of Resh as the stages of the Sun.
Re: True Will. The relationship of this sort of "living mandala" practice through the day to True Will is... Well, foundational to my own conception of True Will is that each of us has our own flavor and part to play within the whole. Working with something that seems to intentionally present a holistic conception of the self as stages of the day may serve to gear the mind toward more readily accepting that divergent Wills may all serve the whole, as well as acceptance of the distinctiveness of our own individual Wills.
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Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law.
@Jim Eshelman said
"But (politics and social engineering aside), religion has always meant the same as yoga. The first literally means "reconnecting," and the second means "union.""
I really want to believe this, especially since Joseph Campbell said almost the exact same thing, but my own research is telling me otherwise.
I looked up religio in my Traupman Latin & English Dictionary (which I purchased at Mr. Eshelman's recommendation; thank you!), and it doesn't actually have anything resembling "reconnecting" as the definition:
@Traupman said
"religio -onis f religion; religious scruple, sense of right, conscience; misgivings; reverence, awe; sanctity, holiness; sect, cult; mode of worship; object of veneration, sacred object, sacred place; divine service, worship, ceremonies; religious practice, ritual; (pej) taboo; superstition; manifestation of a divine sanction; (w. gen) scruple about, scrupulous regard for"
The only neighboring word that has a meaning resembling "reconnecting" (or "to link back or bind," as Campbell put it) is religo, but that's missing an "i."
@Traupman said
"religo -are -avi -atus tr to tie back, tie up; to moor (ship); to untie, unfasten; to bind (with a wreath, ribbon)"
If we remove the prefix "re-," we can find "ligo" as a word, but not "ligio"... It has essentially the same meaning as "religo" above.
Any help or insight into this will be greatly appreciated.
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@Zalthos said
"Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law.
@Jim Eshelman said
"But (politics and social engineering aside), religion has always meant the same as yoga. The first literally means "reconnecting," and the second means "union.""
I really want to believe this, especially since Joseph Campbell said almost the exact same thing, but my own research is telling me otherwise.
I looked up religio in my Traupman Latin & English Dictionary (which I purchased at Mr. Eshelman's recommendation; thank you!), and it doesn't actually have anything resembling "reconnecting" as the definition"
Traupman is the standard for Latin, yes... but necessarily the best source for etymology. For example, it doesn't include every word known from Latin, just the ones most likely to be encountered (unless you got the unabridged, which set you back hundreds of dollars).
The English word religion is essentially "re-ligature" - re-connect. It has a 12th Century Middle English origin, tracing back to the Latin root religio (which, as you noted, simply means "religion," or words like conscience, holiness, etc.) This Latin word, in turn, emerges from re + ligare, "to tie or fasten." (Interestingly, the English word rely also comes from this. I'd missed that link before.)
"The only neighboring word that has a meaning resembling "reconnecting" (or "to link back or bind," as Campbell put it) is religo, but that's missing an "i.""
I'm not home, so can't look it up. I think this is one of those words that just isn't in Traupman. (The standard edition isn't exhaustive. It's just the best there is, except for the Traupman unabridged. I've never seen one of those outside of a college library reference section.)
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Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law.
@Jim Eshelman said
"The English word religion is essentially "re-ligature" - re-connect. It has a 12th Century Middle English origin, tracing back to the Latin root religio (which, as you noted, simply means "religion," or words like conscience, holiness, etc.) This Latin word, in turn, emerges from re + ligare, "to tie or fasten." (Interestingly, the English word rely also comes from this. I'd missed that link before.)
I'm not home, so can't look it up. I think this is one of those words that just isn't in Traupman. (The standard edition isn't exhaustive. It's just the best there is, except for the Traupman unabridged. I've never seen one of those outside of a college library reference section.)"
Rest assured, I have an abridged, 700 page paperback version. Although I'd love to have an unabridged edition, I don't have that kinda cash available for books right now!
I did actually find another word, right above "religio" that resembles what we're talking about: "religatio -onis," which has the singular definition of "tying back or up." I apologize for overlooking that and not providing it in my previous post.
I found something under the etymology section of the Religion wikipedia page that reinforces your point a bit:
@Wikipedia said
"Religion (from O.Fr. religion "religious community," from L. religionem (nom. religio) "respect for what is sacred, reverence for the gods," "obligation, the bond between man and the gods") is derived from the Latin religiō, the ultimate origins of which are obscure. ... Modern scholars such as Tom Harpur and Joseph Campbell favor the derivation from ligare "bind, connect", probably from a prefixed re-ligare, i.e. re (again) + ligare or "to reconnect," which was made prominent by St. Augustine, following the interpretation of Lactantius. The medieval usage alternates with order in designating bonded communities like those of monastic orders: "we hear of the 'religion' of the Golden Fleece, of a knight 'of the religion of Avys'"."
I have to know more about St. Augustine's use of this! Definitely something worth researching, methinks...
EDIT: Found a great source on this topic!!! Check this link out, and scroll down to "Definitions of Religion and Philosophy." Quite enlightening, and it is a proponent for the same roots that you propose!
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