The "Supreme Secret" of th O.T.O.
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@Michael Staley said
"In other words: it might work, it might work a bit, it might not work at all, it might have the opposite effect of that intended. Using this gun you might hit the target, miss the target, or it might blow up in your hands. Hmmm."
Hmm, when you put it this way, it looks actually like there's no causal efficacy at all, with results being completely random. The only thing against this point would be that if the "reversal" effects really are somehow a genuine negative of the desired effect - that would pin it down and make it seem less chancey. But wrt to money, one's fortunes usually go up and down a fair bit anyway, so it's hard to see how that could be a proper test.
This kind of thing is why I find it hard to believe that magick is anything other than daydreaming or Confirmation Bias. I am a firm believer in the truth and validity of mystical results, but when it comes to magick, all I see is people like Crowley wasting their lives following the random whims of their unconscious.
Maybe
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@h2h said
"No, the Supreme Secret is that while everyone else is fixating on the Supreme Secret and its efficaciousness, somebody is getting laid. A lot.
I've said this before on Lashtal but I regard the 9th degree = Supreme Secret to be a red herring. The Supreme Secret lies with Baphomet. DWTWSBTWOTL!"
Ever thought that it might be a physical symbol of that?
IAO131
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No, because everyone insists on the 9th degree because AC says so. You're already lost when you take things on faith of another man.
Yes, the 9th degree can be a physical symbol of the Supreme Secret. But it's not the Secret. You'll get to it faster by researching the initiation system of the Assassins.
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@Michael Staley said
"The "Supreme Secret", then, may be more a chimera than anything else."
I've had a wild thought running through the back of my brain for a while:
What if the use of a "real person" as the partner is the problem? Maybe the optimal use of this technology is to do it with one's HGA...?
Could this be why Crowley said that only the 5=6 Within can be admitted to the full practice of the formula of the Rosy Cross??Steve
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@RifRaf said
"The true secret is....
George Bush hates black people."
You go, Kanye...
Cranny: Unless your HGA emits fluids, it would be hard to do with them.
IAO131
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H2H...I think you nailed it
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Just so everyone understands my administrative view on this post...
My opinion is that the post is ill-placed and bordering on off-topic. This forum has nothing to do with O.T.O., so something framed in terms of specific O.T.O. matters seems somewhere between bad taste and O.T.
However, when I read it early this morning, I concluded it didn't actually violate anyone's proprietary rights or reveal any honestly obligated material. It doesn't break any actual rule for the forum. Therefore, I left it.
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@Jim Eshelman said
"My opinion is that the post is ill-placed and bordering on off-topic. This forum has nothing to do with O.T.O., so something framed in terms of specific O.T.O. matters seems somewhere between bad taste and O.T."
I realise that O.T.O. matters have no place on this forum. The reference is only in passing, since the technique under discussion is described as the "supreme secret" of that august body. As for "ill-placed" and "bordering off-topic", yes this post might equally have been nestling in the 'Mysticism' or 'Magick' forums; I'll give more thought to the placing of posts in the future.
That clarified, we can return to the discussion.
Best wishes,
Michael.
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To be clear - I didn't mean OT based on where you posted it, but rather than any discussion of something distinctly O.T.O. is likely off-topic to any location on this forum.
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h2h
Do you know the secret of which you speak?
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Regarding the "reversal effect," and without addressing the secret of any O.T.O. degree per se...
Look around in another forum here for my recent remarks on money spells in general. It's a bad basis for evaluating any technique.
Second, on the reversal issue itself, consider the published "penalty clause" of the Golden Dawn 5=6 oath. (If you're interested enough, you either know it or can easily look it up.) I suggest this saying only that it is not an irrelevant remark.
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@666 said
""The supreme secret of the O.T.O. is[...]written plainly in Liber CCCXXXIII, Cap. XXXVI(The Star Sapphire)." - De Arte Magica, Cap. I"
...can anyone say "cream pie snow ball"?
@Jim Eshelman said
"To be clear - I didn't mean OT based on where you posted it, but rather than any discussion of something distinctly O.T.O. is likely off-topic to any location on this forum."
What about the instance of the 'Supreme Secret' of the O.T.O. being written plainly in an A.'.A.'. document? Is The Star Sapphire open for candid discussion in reference to A.'.A.'. rather than O.T.O.?
616
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@Parzival said
"h2h
Do you know the secret of which you speak?"
Parzival,
Any answer I give would only mislead. That noted, I would like to amend an earlier remark:
You're already lost when you take things on faith of another man.
And state:
*You’re *not there yet ** if you take things on faith of another man.
solve et coagula,
h2h -
@KRVB MMShCh said
"
@Jim Eshelman said
"To be clear - I didn't mean OT based on where you posted it, but rather than any discussion of something distinctly O.T.O. is likely off-topic to any location on this forum."What about the instance of the 'Supreme Secret' of the O.T.O. being written plainly in an A.'.A.'. document?"
If that were true then there would no read even to mention O.T.O. or its proprietary secrets, right?
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@Jim Eshelman said
"If that were true then there would no read even to mention O.T.O. or its proprietary secrets, right?"
...an oath of secrecy is one thing, but proprietary knowledge!?
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@Lapis said
"
@Jim Eshelman said
"If that were true then there would no read even to mention O.T.O. or its proprietary secrets, right?"...an oath of secrecy is one thing, but proprietary knowledge!?
"Yes, I regard their specific teachings and formal instruction as their property.
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93 all.
I am more interested in the 11th degree work involving Kalas, outside of the male body. (Not the Homosexual version of the Caliphate, but that of the Typhonian).
Michael, can you elaborate on this? Perhaps we can discuss some pros and cons to these workings.
I feel that the tincture of the 9th degree "secret" is not all there is too it.
Just thought I would bring this up to make things a bit more interesting,
With best regards.93 93/93.'.
Shachdar
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@Michael Staley said
"Looking at Crowley's life, it's difficult to recognose the fruits of this technique. Being almost permanently on the edge of destitution, many of his Operations were quite understandably for money. "
Slightly off topic but I always found it funny that certain factions in the Thelemic and Occult communities push the idea that one must be successful financially to be a "true" adept etc. yadda yadda yadda and yet there supreme example is Al Crowley...
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93
The very fact that there are opposing fractions at all within the thelemic and occult communities quite frankly amazes me.
At least the level of it. Respecting each others respective reality tunnels might be a contribution to a more constructive cooexistence?
Edit: coexistence.
93 93/93
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OK, I'm locking this thread. End of discussion. Take your organizational bashing somewhere else. This board is not available for that kind of agenda.