LBRP Questions
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@Jim Eshelman said
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@MMe said
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@Jim Eshelman said
"This might be easier if you mentioned which of the many printed instructions for the Pentagram Ritual you are following. "I'm starting with "Techniques Of High Magic"(Skinner/King) then put aside for your "776 1/2", Black Pearl, In the Continum and Regardie's "Middle Pillar"."
That explans why I couldn't figure out what you were doing - you're doing everybody! <vbg>"
From what I understand it, except for the Thelemic addition, are all the same ritual.
"776 1/2" and "Black Pearl" almost identical,
"In the Continuum" delightful the explanation of Soror Meral,
Regardie's "The Middle Pillar" version also identical, except for the astral expansion before the Qabalistic Cross.
There are so much difference?I do the simple, basic version.
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*I continue here the discussion about the images of Archangels to not dirty the thread about the The Star Ruby *
@Jim Eshelman said
"These are elemental archangels. Even though archangels of the same name serve as sephirothic and planetary archangels, that isn't their role here.
Especially at the beginning, and practically thereafter, my recommendation is to keep it simple."
Ok, so I need only to look at row 11, 23, 31 and 32 bis of 776 1/2, right?
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Yes.
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"* All the visualizations are to be done in first person? For example visualizing Kether I find myself in third person view, like seeing the whole scene from outside."
I'm not sure I understand the question, but I'll give it a try:
"The "Kether" in question is not the Absolute Abstract Kether, but a sphere of white light a few inches above the crown of your head. Visualize this from within your normal point of view (wherever that is in your body).
"@Jim: Fyi. First person is like playing a FPS games, like COD or Counter Strike, looking through the eyes of the character and only seeing your hands and gun in front of you on the screen. Just like to experimental cameras they are testing on cops in some states. I don't quite understand his question either, so I think he is referring to Third person view, seeing yourself from 10ft overhead behind or in front of you, like most RPG games. Is that a problem? I visualize things in Third person. Would it imply looking at oneself as a stranger? Not comfortable as how one see's them self?
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@MMe said
"In the Qabalistic Cross when I finished drawing it, became natural for me to assume the whole figure, I become the cross, as usually done for the Godform. Am I doing it wrong?"
I'm not authority, but that is what I imagined the visualization was "supposed" to be. I think looking at it from the perspective of right or wrong in a lot of cases is something that can stop progress (aside from the basic structure of the ritual described). The approach that I like to lean towards is to do it, document it or note it mentally, and move on. If one is persistent, then what is "right" or "wrong" for you will become self-evident. This is all supposing there isn't a line of teaching you are following formally that gives different direction.
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@MMe said
"In the Qabalistic Cross when I finished drawing it, became natural for me to assume the whole figure, I become the cross, as usually done for the Godform. Am I doing it wrong?"
Nothing wrong with it at all. Not necesssarily "standard," but a perception that arises naturally from the other visualizations.
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Hi all,
This is my first post.
I've been practicing the LBRP for awhile now and I've found it is much stronger when I use my left hand. FYI, I am left handed. Is doing this with my left hand a problem?
Thanks,
Peacedog
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No.
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A very noob questions:
The Kether center is situated just over the forehead or a little behind?
In the Qabalistic Cross the shaft of white light that goes from Kether to Malkuth is the same as the MP? Is to be visualized as the latter? Slightly in front of me and don't within me, right?
The hexagram is 2d or 3d? Should have a little thickness/depth?
In another post you said@Jim Eshelman said
"No. The pentagrams are drawn as if on at an infinite distance - one of the reason for keeping one's arm perfectly straight through the whole process (so that proportions remain the same at all distances)."
Also in the invocation of the Archangels the arms are to be full straight?
@Jim Eshelman said
"The archangels are thus within them (as all things are), at the perimeter of one's area of operation."
The Archangels and the pentagrams are to be visualized fused together?
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@Dar said
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@MMe said
"Also in the invocation of the Archangels the arms are to be full straight?"Why? Have your Archangels ever complained about your less than straight arms? Hmmm?"
I know my questions are silly
, but I prefer to be a honest ignorant than something else...and ask questions, even the most stupid.
But your answer is interesting, thanks. -
93,
"Also in the invocation of the Archangels the arms are to be full straight?
"That's correct. There are various explanations for this that could be offered, but a simple one is that it emphasizes the movement of energy or light to the extremes of your own aura.
"The Archangels and the pentagrams are to be visualized fused together?"
No, definitely not. The visualizations should be maintained as separate things, occurring on separate planes.
When I utter the final phrase of the invocatory segment ("For about me flames the pentagram... etc.") I don't hold the image of the Archangels in mind at all. They've been called in, or you might say "have been noticed yet again," and they remain in position. That last part before going once again into "Attah-Aiwass-Malkuth" is a point when you see your own being as central within the arrangement of the pentagrams, and dominated or lit by a central hexagram.
93 93/93,
Edward -
@Edward Mason said
"When I utter the final phrase of the invocatory segment ("For about me flames the pentagram... etc.") I don't hold the image of the Archangels in mind at all."
Until now I've tried to visualize all together... I'll try tonight, thanks.
In "Black Pearl" and in "776 1/2" there is no explanation about it.@MMe said
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@Jim Eshelman said
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@MMe said
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I'm starting with "Techniques Of High Magic"(Skinner/King) then put aside for your "776 1/2", Black Pearl, In the Continum and Regardie's "Middle Pillar"."That explans why I couldn't figure out what you were doing - you're doing everybody! <vbg>"
From what I understand it, except for the Thelemic addition, are all the same ritual."
I just finished re-reading the "The Continuum" version and is a little different...
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very very noob questions, excuse me...
@MMe said
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- [:230rc9zz]The Kether center is situated just over the forehead or a little behind?[/
230rc9zz]
[:230rc9zz]In the Qabalistic Cross the shaft of white light that goes from Kether to Malkuth is the same as the MP? Is to be visualized as the latter? Slightly in front of me and don't within me, right?[/230rc9zz]
[:230rc9zz]The hexagram is 2d or 3d? Should have a little thickness/depth?[/230rc9zz]
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@Edward Mason said
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When I utter the final phrase of the invocatory segment ("For about me flames the pentagram... etc.") I don't hold the image of the Archangels in mind at all. They've been called in, or you might say "have been noticed yet again," and they remain in position.
"But when I recall the pentagrams is it not to be intendet that the pentagrams ban the archangels?
- [:230rc9zz]The Kether center is situated just over the forehead or a little behind?[/
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@MMe said
"But when I recall the pentagrams is it not to be intendet that the pentagrams ban the archangels?"
I don't understand what you mean by "recall the pentagrams" - but, in any case, there is never any intention to ban the archangels.
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Another question
When performing the LBRP outside at sunrise, facing due east is not where the sun is rising. Should a person face the direction or where the sun is actually rising on the horizon?
Mme, I think the hexagram is the column above and below you, I could be wrong, I usually am. -
It's not per se about facing the Sun. East (in the broad sense of the whole eastern half of the sky) is where all light always originates. Due east is that direction toward which your exact location is moving in space, by virtue of the earth's rotation.
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Thank you for your rapid response.
I ask the question because I have the opportunity to be outside and watch the sun rise nearly every day. Practicing the LBRP directionally seems odd to me when I can clearly see the sun rising about 30 degrees to my right. I am wondering if there is any additional benefit by directly facing the sun standing at samech and pe? -
@MMe said
"Where is to be visualize the hexagram?
At which point exactly?"I did the question, a bit stupid
, because I realized, a few days ago, that in English it says "in the column" while in the translation that I have studied and used for years, is "above me", and I, therefore, visualize the hexagram above me.
Then I read the book of David Shoemaker(I also have your book, but does not say anything about it), and he says to visualize the hexagram at the heart.So I'm a bit confusing...
@Fr Cognosco cum Lux
Thanks for the answer.
For the East question look here jim's answer.